my Baby boy Jack the Boxer

[Jacktheboxer]

I am hoping I can get some guidance here.
i have a 7 year old male boxer.
he has always been super athletic and smart.
He had slowly been gaining weight his 5th year but we assumed tht it due to us being more careful with his play as he was having issues with his back knees.
in November 2015 he started wetting his bed. this is a dog that was extremely easy to house break and had NEVER even had an accident.
vet diagnosed UTI, got antibiotics, but the urinating didnt stop, it got worse, with the drinking and panting.
finally he was diagnosed with Cushings.
Long story short, Jack is in terrible shape.
he isnt himself at all. i keep taking hit to the Vet, he has been tested several times, the Vet says the leveles are under control, but my poor boy is a shadow of himself.
we have thought we were going tolose him several times. he started Vetoryl at 30mg, went up to 60mg, then 90mg and the last time he was upped to 120.
he also has hypothyroidism.
the dose of 120 turned him into a zombie and we dialed back against the vets recommendation. I now have him at 60mg /day which seems to let his personality peek through.
here are my issues.
Jack has lost 20 lbs ( grated he was chubby to begin with) and now looks malnourished.
i have to feed him with a turkey baster as he has zero interest in food. lately he seems to have forgotten how to drink occasionally so when he does i use turkey baster with that too.
when he has his vetoryl he is lethargic and not eating, when i dont give it he is running around in circles and compulsively like he has lost his mind. it is not a run for pleasure, it is panicked.
He gets head tremors nightly and occasional (daily) twitches that seem like he has electrical shocks going through his body.
he recognized us, and follows commands, bt has lost all joy for life.
he either lays on his bed or runs/wonders in circles. those are the only two modes.
when this started we were in California. we came to Costa Rica to spend the summer here, but decided to stay as Jack is in no shape to fly.
we have a great vet here.but he doesnt know what else to do.
we have had all tests and ultrasounds.
his levels are correct, but the meds are killing him.

what can we do?
what is up with the tremors, shocks and running??

thank you so much

[dsbailey]

Hi,

Sorry to hear about Jack (I love boxers).

Would you please post the following:

Jack's last ACTH Stimulation test results with the two pre and post values and units.
The weight he was and dosage of Veroryl he was on at that time.
Was he diagnosed with Pituitary (PDH) or Adrenal (ADH) Cushings?
The results and remarks of his latest Ultrasound.
Recent Bloodwork and Urinalysis results listing the only abnormal ones along with the range values and units of measure for those items an example with my girl: ALK Phosphate 422(High) 5-131 U/L
What are his current Cushings Symptoms (The Typical Ones)?


There will be more members along the way asking for these numbers (and more) and this can get things moving faster. Great people.

What pops into my head is Jack has really screwed up cortisol levels with a dog that wants to crawl out of his own skin. The other more serious is a Pituitary Macrotumor. Here's a link to an article to read http://www.endocrinevet.info/2011/07/q-pituitary-macrotumor-in-dog-with.html then google and read more. I believe there's another dog recently evaluated and other members who've had these treated.

I'm not an expert but a few of them will be along in a bit. The more information you can provide the better the answers will be.

Good Luck and Welcome - you came to the right place for answers and support.

Darrell and Lolita

[spdd]

So sorry to read this. The weight is important to know as his meds seem very high to me, but the experts here will tell you more. Good luck with Jack. If anyone can help you, it's the years of experience you will get from some of our members. They have done a lot of research and are up to the latest in their knowledge, more so then most vets, believe it or not. They saved my guy when all the vet(s) wanted to do was put him down....

[Budsters Mom]

I agree with Judi. Stop the Vetoryl. It should not be given to a dog who is not eating. That can be very dangerous.

[molly muffin]

Hello and welcome to the forum.

Now to the immediate issue, as the others have stated, if a dog is not eating they should not be given vetroyl/trilostane.
Aside from the issue that a sick dog should Not be receiving cushings meds, vetroyl has to be given with food to be absorbed properly and that isn't going to happen when not eating.

My first concern is a macro pituitary tumor.
We seem to see a larger amount of dogs with the brachycephelic characteristics having macro's.
With a macro tumor, the pituitary tumor grows and puts pressure on different nerve points of the brain.
Not eating, staring, circling, and several other neurological types of sypmtoms can be associated with this. It gets worse and time goes on.
Unfortunately if this is the case, the vertroyl could be adding to the problems, as increased cortisol typically can help keep inflammation from the tumor more controlled and the vetroyl is lowering it, which might be why he does better on lower amounts of vetroyl.

I would stop vetroyl and see how he does.
The numbers of the ACTH testing is very important to see exactly what his numbers are in relations to guidelines presented by both the manufacturer of the medication and the top specialist in cushings, which is what we go by as far as guidelines.

[Squirt's Mom]

Hi and welcome to you and Jack! :)

Unfortunately, a macro is what first came to my mind reading your description of your baby boy's behavior. If I were you, I would stop the Vetoryl, probably for good, and if at all possible get an MRI of Jack's skull cavity. This should tell you if this is a larger tumor, where it is, what kind, and hopefully how it can be handled. This is one area that the US has been behind other countries like The Netherlands but over the last few years we have come a long way in addressing tumors of the brain in our canine companions. But the first step is to determine if that is in fact what Jack is dealing with. We have a thread started by one of our members about macroadenomas, or macros as we call them. This thread became a sort of diary where other members came and recorded their journey with this uncommon complication of Cushing's. It may help you to read some of these member's posts and see if your baby boy can be seen in their descriptions of life with their babies.

http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3567

But at least for now, do stop the Vetoryl. ;)

I'm glad you found us and look forward to seeing those test results Darrell asked about. You should know that you and Jack are now part of our little family - you will never be alone, we will be with you every step of the way. Never hesitate to ask questions or simply reach out because you need to talk to someone.

Hugs,
Leslie and the gang