Finn

[Finn's_mom]

Hello, everyone! I'm desperately hoping someone can give me some guidance for my sweet, little boy, Finn. He is a Shih Tzu, rescued thru a group in June 2013. We don't know his exact age but think he's pretty close to 8yo. He came to us with a big pot belly and consuming large amounts of water. We had to put him in belly bands right from the start due to his excess urination. We thought this was just the way here was, but in Feb 2015 he began having chronic ear/skin infections. Our vet treated with antibiotics and steroids. However the episodes kept recurring and our vet decided it was food allergies. I put him on a raw, frozen, no-grain, unique protein diet. No luck. I should also mention he is overweight and in trying to put him on a diet, his weight won't budge. I have been thinking for quite awhile his immune system is way out of wack. And because of all the antibiotics, I thought maybe he might have a raging yeast infecting. So I researched that and read how yeast infections can go along with hypothyroidism. So just recently our vet ran a complete thyroid panel. He said the results showed he was a Cushingoid dog. Last week he ran a low dex test but just yesterday said those results showed he wasn't a Cushingoid dog and now he's back to thinking it's allergies and wants to put him on Apoquel for a month (which I'm not going to do).

My gut tells me he's a Cushingoid dog. He has all the classic symptoms of Cushings in a dog: excess water intake/urination, pot belly, patches of hair loss, panting, obesity, lack of energy, darkening of the skin. Recently, we've also had to start treating him for congestive heart failure.

Someone, please help! I need advice as to my next step. I don't understand how one week our vet can say Finn has Cushings and the next he doesn't. I don't understand how he can have all the classic symptoms of Cushings and yet my vet says no. To me, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck.

Finn is such a sweet little boy! My husband and I just love him to pieces and want to figure out what we need to do to get him healthy. Any advice will be most welcome!

[kanga]

Hope you find some good information and good advice! So sorry don't have any good advice, I pray for your doggy hope he will get better soon.

[dsbailey]

Hi Finn's Mom,

Can you post the results of the LDDS test and also the results from the thyroid panel and any out of range results from any other tests run. Sounds like the vet is being lackadaisical about finding a solution to the problems. I'd ask my vet to run a full senior panel with urine. If Finn were a Cush dog some of his liver enzymes would be out of range ALTK, ALT, etc... If that didn't show anything abnormal I'd have an abdominal ultrasound. This can check out the adrenal glands, gall bladder, liver, bladder, pancreas, etc.... There will be more people by throughout the day with more advice and ideas, listen to them because they've been there and back.

Darrell and LO

[DoxieMama]

Hi there, and welcome to you and Finn! As Darrell mentioned, if you can post the results of the tests that were run (along with the reference ranges) that would help us provide you with the best support. The LDDS test is the gold standard for diagnosis, so I'm really curious what those results show. If you don't have copies of the tests, just ask your vet for them. :)

I look forward to learning more about Finn!

Shana

[Joan2517]

Welcome from me, too! Yes, it is so confusing, but you will find plenty of help here.

[judymaggie]

Welcome to you and Finn! As others have said, knowing the results of the tests that have been done will help us a great deal when helping you figure out what is going on with Finn. With regard to any blood tests that were done, you need only provide the tests that had high or low results along with the range. For example, "ALT 130 H (range 12-118)". The LDDS test will have three numbers: baseline, 4 hr. and 8 hr.

With regard to the thyroid tests, it would probably be best to provide us with all of those results as sometimes low normals can still indicate a problem. I would be very interested to know how your vet is able to diagnose Cushing's from thyroid tests. Interestingly, many of the symptoms of a dog who has thyroid issues are similar to a dog with Cushing's so differentiating one from the other can be complicated and would absolutely need additional testing.

It is possible that a dog who has a negative LDDS test will be diagnosed with Cushing's. Given all the symptoms you are seeing, additional diagnostic tests such as an ACTH and an abdominal ultrasound would be in order.

I'm sorry to read that Finn has been diagnosed with congestive heart failure. How was that diagnosis made? Wondering if an ultrasound was done which might offer information about his other organs (such as liver, adrenal glands, etc.). Please let us know what medications Finn is on for this condition as well as any other medications he is currently taking.

[molly muffin]

My dog always tested negative on the ldds test. I'd check the ACTH to see where the cortisol is actually at. My dog tested positive on the ACTH, she didn't have all the symptoms of cushings and not all dogs have all symptoms, but eventually she got more and more of them.
So I think that would be a next step to try and figure things out.

[Finn's_mom]

Thanks to everyone for their replies and advice! It helps to know we're not alone in this. Trying to fight the uphill battle against my vet can get discouraging at times. He's a good vet, but just think he's out of his depth now. I will get a copy of test results and post them. Thanks again so much everyone!

[Finn's_mom]

Welcome to you and Finn! As others have said, knowing the results of the tests that have been done will help us a great deal when helping you figure out what is going on with Finn. With regard to any blood tests that were done, you need only provide the tests that had high or low results along with the range. For example, "ALT 130 H (range 12-118)". The LDDS test will have three numbers: baseline, 4 hr. and 8 hr.

With regard to the thyroid tests, it would probably be best to provide us with all of those results as sometimes low normals can still indicate a problem. I would be very interested to know how your vet is able to diagnose Cushing's from thyroid tests. Interestingly, many of the symptoms of a dog who has thyroid issues are similar to a dog with Cushing's so differentiating one from the other can be complicated and would absolutely need additional testing.

It is possible that a dog who has a negative LDDS test will be diagnosed with Cushing's. Given all the symptoms you are seeing, additional diagnostic tests such as an ACTH and an abdominal ultrasound would be in order.

I'm sorry to read that Finn has been diagnosed with congestive heart failure. How was that diagnosis made? Wondering if an ultrasound was done which might offer information about his other organs (such as liver, adrenal glands, etc.). Please let us know what medications Finn is on for this condition as well as any other medications he is currently taking.

I, too, had read on the internet that is possible to test negative on the LDDS test and still have Cushings, but a Cushingoid dog will never test negative on both the LDDS and ACTH.

Finn was diagnosed with CHF with an xray showing an enlarged heart. He also had a cough that sounded like a goose honk and the coughing coincided with the onset of hot, humid weather down here in TX.