My dog has an adrenal gland mass - sweet Tigger has passed [Archive] - Canine Cushing's Information and Support Forums

Trish

05-24-2013, 07:04 PM

Hi and welcome to you and Tigger! Love that name, we had a cat called Tigger many years ago, she was bouncy just like her name :)

You say that Tigger began stumbling and walking funny, is that just recent? Also that she has cushings too according to blood tests, what symptoms does she have like drinking and peeing heaps or eating like a horse?? It really would be great if you could post these details and also if you have reports of her ultrasound and the blood tests to confirm the cushings and th other blood tests like her liver ones it would be really helpful. If you do not have them grab a copy from your vet. Make sure you post the reference ranges too please. Did they start her on treatment for cushings?

My dog did have an adrenalectomy nearly six months ago now and is doing pretty well, but his tumour was not cushings related, it was a pheochromocytoma and he had very high BP associated with that. Have they checked Tigger's BP?

Some adrenal masses can be benign and not cause the dog any problems, so it would be good to confirm why your vet is suggesting you remove it and to confirm he does indeed have symptoms of cushings. Hind leg weakness is a symptom of cushings but they usually have the other signs as well such as the drinking and peeing excessively. Removing an adrenal tumour when there is only stumbling just seems a little odd to me, I would have thought there would be other symptoms that would make them think that weakness is tied in with that tumour. So knowing more of your history might be helpful for us to put all the pieces together :)

I am saying this because my dog had his 6 month checkup ultrasound just this week, he also has a nodule in his remaining adrenal but he has no symptoms from it so it is not worth the risk of removing it. This nodule was there prior to his sugery in December and the surgeon had a good look and it was presumed to be benign and it has not changed in the six months since. A lot of dogs will have lumps and bumps in adrenals, liver, spleen that do not cause them trouble so the trick is deciding whether the tumour it is potentially life threatening when deciding whether it is worth the risk of removing it.

Has Tigger seen a specialist or is this your local GP type vet giving you advice? Because if you decide to go ahead with this surgery you need a board certified surgeon as this is indeed an operation that needs a very very experienced surgeon who has done this procedure many times.

So if you can collect up the latest Tigger results and list all of her symptoms we can all have a look over it together!

Glad you found us :)
Trish :)

molly muffin

05-24-2013, 07:24 PM

Hello and welcome from me too.
Trish has asked all the really good questions already. I'll just send you a great big virtual hug as I am sure you are need of one about right now.
I know this is Not an easy decision to have to make and I really wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Sharlene and Molly Muffin

Rfeniolo

05-24-2013, 09:25 PM

Thank-you all soo much for your warm
Welcomes for me and Tigger.
I don't have all of the specifics on tiggys
Tests but I will try to give you more of
The details until I can gather specifics.
So yes my Tiggy just started walking
Funny about 2 wks ago suddenly.
After performing bloodwork, ultrasound
And cushings blood test, my vet was
Trying to determine if her gait was due to
Something neurological or related to
The cushings/mass. vet said i seems like caused
By brain lesion, she wouldnt
Opt for surgery of adrenal mass. I
took her to a
Neurologist who said he thinks its unrelated
And that the gait is coming from something
With her neck. What with neck he couldn't say.
At this point, we have not started any meds
For cushings. Vet said it could be 3
Possibilities of what type of tumor it is
One chance being pheochromocytoma.
She said only way to know is MRI but doesn't
Recommend an MRI bc of the risk involved
And wouldn't want to chance losing her
For only a test.
Tigger has a "potbellied" appearance.
Have not noticed her drinking excessively
But she does love to eat and is always looking
For food.
Her blood pressure was checked at vet
Last week and it was 160. Vet said this
Could change though at different times.
Recommends trying for removal with a 40%
Chance of losing her. The fear seems to
Be that eventually, it will grow into
Vital arteries or metastasize. Don't think
It has at this point but would do another
Ultrasound before surgery to make sure
It hasn't gotten worse.
Dr. White has been recommended for
Surgery in conn. or I may be able to bring
Her to Tufts.
My first question is: would it be in Tiggers
Best interest to put her through such a
Risky and grueling surgery & recovery
At the age of 13?
I am such a wreck and half of the time
I think to do it and other half I think not.
I sympathize with fellas Mom. My heart
Breaks for her and terrifies me to think I could
Be faced with the same devastating outcome.
I will try to gather some more specific
Information but hopefully this helps.
So thankful that I found you all and this
Forum.

Trish

05-24-2013, 10:25 PM

Hi again!

So the wobbly walking is probably something musculo-skeletal according to neurologist, something in the neck so maybe not related to any cushings diagnosis.

Tigger has minimal actual cushings symptoms, but it will be good to see her numbers and the scan report when you can get your hands on them.

That BP is not too bad, considering stress of having it taken. But if it was a pheo then they are often up and down as the tumours secrete catchecholamines at differnt times and you might just not get it at the right time.

I am not sure why surgery has been recommended unless it is something on the scan that was concerning the vet. As I have said they can have a nodule and it not cause problems. I would hate to have to go through surgery if this nodule was never going to cause a problem! But then whether it is going to cause a problem is often hard to tell.

When my dog was in the process of getting diagnosed, they insisted on a CT to check whether there was any spread, including into lungs. That is an important diagnostic tool, MRI is better but we did not have that option available. These more advanced scans can give a better idea on type of tumour too, for example my dogs tumour as a pheo usually arises in medulla of adrenal. But for those in the adrenal cortex, it is more difficult to decide whether it is potentially malignant or benign. Unfortunately biopsy is not really possible because of location of the adrenal gland.

I think you need to visit the surgeon with Tigger and get their input into whether deciding whether this is the way to go for her as it is a big decision especially in a dog that is not displaying an awful lot of symptoms at the moment, I would want to know what the surgeon thought about all my points below:

I have copied and pasted this from another thread when I wrote this out for a member as a guide for making a decision on adrenalectomy.

This is what I based my decision on when trying to figure out what to do, I have included my rationale - keeping in mind Flynn was symptomatic esp from his high BP.

1. Expected life span for the dog - probably another 3 - 5 yrs for Flynn
2. Other health problems - heart, lungs no problems apart from BP. But past history of low grade hepatocellular carcinoma one year prior to finding adrenal mass. Successful surgery to remove his huge 650g mass with no sign of recurrence a year later.
3. Surgeon recommendations - yes he would do it for his own dog, yes he had experience with vena cava thrombus extractions with no deaths. University pet hospital - only vet training centre in NZ.
4. Risks - no sign of any tumour spread on CT including chest, understood all other potential problems eg bleeding, anaesthetic, vena cava complications, clots, pancreatitis, death
5. Prognosis if we treated medically - months only
6. Quality of life - for Flynn poor if we did nothing and death a few months away
7. Psychological - (me!) could I accept it if he died during surgery... probably would have hated myself for going through with it, but I still thought if he did die I had given him every chance of a full recovery and at least it would have been quick for him
8. Financially - yes I could afford it, if I keep working till I am 80 haha.. no, not really but it certainly is not cheap. Cost $3100.00 here in NZ including all preop scans including CT
9. Post-op care availability - support from vets, time off work for 2 weeks for me, should have taken more but ran out of leave but I'm lucky I have parents who look after him during day while I work

Hope this helps, we will be with you whatever decision you make!!

Trish :)
PS when writing out your posts just keep on going when you get to the end of the box thingy, the page will readjust when you submit your reply, you do not need to press enter at the end of each line as it makes your posts all skinny!!! :D:D

Rfeniolo

05-25-2013, 09:54 AM

What should I be asking the vet for in terms of scans and specific test results? I'm not too versed in all of this and I'm trying to figure out what everything means.
Regarding Tigger's walking (which has
Improved somewhat since onset 2 wks ago), the neurosurgeon said he thinks its relate to her neck. Said it could be musculoskeletal skeletal, a tumor, a stroke in the neck... He could not give me any further answers.
I am so torn up about all of this as I
Almost cannot function not to mention I have an older basset hound who suddenly couldn't walk last sat. With his own set of health issues. Thank-you for listening to my pleas for help and all the rest as I think this forum is my only saving grace at this time!

Trish

05-25-2013, 07:17 PM

Crikey you do have your hands full. My head was spinning to at this stage in the diagnosis process so keep asking us questions and we will do our best to help you make sense of it all!!

In the initial stage my vet referred me straight to the surgeon for further advice. That is where the CT was done to see if surgery was an option. It may be that an IMS is also a good idea, especially with the possible cushings link, just be aware that more than one test is required to diagnose cushings especially if there are other health problems causing problems like the funny walking for example, this could have raised Tigger's cortisol and led to a positive test when in fact Tigger might not have cushings. So if you do get those tests and post them, the angels here who are much better versed in the cushings stuff than me will be able to offer their opinion on the testing that has been done. Like was it a 2 hr test, or an 8 hr test or a urine test?? So many different things are done by the vets.

Of course, adrenal tumours CAN cause cushings symptoms but with what you have written it does not sound like Tigger has very obvious cushings symptoms.

From what you have said about the ultrasound there is currently no obvious spread and it is not going into vessels so I think you have time to look into this more fully and you do not have to rush into surgey as it does not sound like Tigger is in imminent danger (that being said without the benefit of what they vets know ie bloods and the acutal scan result so of coure they may recommend otherwise)

What the plan with your current vet at the moment?

I would be asking:
1. What is the expected life span of Tigger, I am presuming that because Tigger is a little dog she could have a good few years left but I am not sure on life span of chihuahua's
2. Does Tigger have any other medical conditions that would impact on this ie heart problems
3. If we do not treat this adrenal mass surgically, what is the expected life span before we would see symptoms and what would her quality of life be like? One of our members Kim (frijole) did not go for surgery and her dog Annie lived another pretty good two years, I think from memory she was around Tigger's age, she had a pheochromocytoma too. Annie also had positive cushings tests initially but this was subsequently ruled out which shows that cushings testing can be impacted by other diseases and one positive test is not the final answer on whether Tigger has cushings or not - hopefully Kim will see this as she is much more experienced with that side of things than I am. Another member Ro (cheydogger) also did not do surgery and Chey is still going!
4. Has it spread anywhere, including to lungs etc - if it has spread probably no benefit from doing surgery. Before my dog had his surgery they scanned his lungs, biopsied a liver nodule and a lymph node to check there was no spread because if there was they would not have done the surgery it there was.
5. What symptoms do you think this tumour is causing Tigger AND how we do know if it is the tumour causing her symptoms, ie unsteady gait, pot belly, hunger

That is where I would start and personally I would want to ask a surgeon or IMS!

Hope this helps and does not confuse you more :)
Trish

frijole

05-25-2013, 08:17 PM

Hello. My Annie had a pheo tumor and I'm chiming in because she would periodically fall down - actually she's be running around like usual and her back leg would fail. We did all sorts of film and tests - don't remember who ended up telling me it was the pheo. It was out of the blue and most of the time she was fine.

Trish is right the blood pressure is only high when the tumor is active and emitting.

Take your time - and go to a specialist before making any decisions. It took us over a year to figure out what was wrong and she was too weak for surgery at that time. My girl lived with the pheo for two years but all cases are different. Did they tell you how large the tumor is and where it is located? Kim

Rfeniolo

05-26-2013, 12:01 AM

Thank-you for your post as those are all very good questions that I will ask the vet. Is anesthesia required to do a ct scan or the other test you were referring to? The only test that they wanted to do was an MRI but decided it wasn't a good option due to the risk of anesthesia. For cushings diagnosis vet did an 8 hr test taking blood 3 times. She did not suppress from my understanding hence the diagnosis. She does now have a heart murmur and slightly enlarged heart & liver. We celebrated her 13 th bday today and I was a bit concerned when I noticed her stumble a few times. She does pant quite often and is always wanting to eat.
Does anyone have a surgeon recommendation in CT or surrounding area? And do we know if Annie was put on any meds when decided not to do surgery? Much appreciation for all of your help! This forum is quickly becoming a great blessing to me!

Rfeniolo

05-26-2013, 12:13 AM

Believe mass is in left adrenal gland and is pretty large. Was also stated that there is mineralization or calcification which historically is said to signify that it's cancerous. I feel as if I need to hurry up and make a decision because the vet said that a lot can change in even 2 wks. Wish I knew exactly what we are dealin with- If it's a pheochromocytoma or not. Have to take tiggy back to neurosurgeon for a recheck on wed to see if she has gotten any better/worse with her gait etc. The neurosurgeon is the one who said to hold off on surgery at least until after the recheck a week and a half later so that will be Wed morning. Would like to meet with a surgeon soon as well.

frijole

05-26-2013, 12:44 AM

Annie was put under for the MRI and other tests throughout her ordeal and she never had any problems. She was at K State Univ's Teaching Hospital and they were top notch. Her BP was not elevated during her visit.

Her tumor was small but she had the panting, stumbling, heart murmur (sporadically when the tumor was active) She just took blood pressure meds and that was it. Her main issue was hair loss, weight loss (over time) and she quit eating. I treated her with acupuncture and it worked wonders (gave her energy)

Find out what they mean by "large" - we've seen it exagerated before. Their concern is that it will grow quickly and invade the vena cava by the heart. That is regardless of what type of tumor it is. The only reason they want to rule in/out pheochromocytoma is that because it basically emits adrenaline it makes surgery riskier should the tumor decide to become active while under sedation.

Your vet should recommend a surgeon to you and understand this is something you want the best of the best on - they need to have alot of experience with this surgery as it is complicated. That said we have had members with success stories - one of them is Trish who lives in New Zealand.

Get copies of all tests that were done as well as the write ups on ultrasounds and share so we have more info to help you. Kim

Trish

05-26-2013, 06:01 AM

HAPPY 13TH BIRTHDAY TO TIGGER!!!

I hope you all had a special day celebrating her birthday!!

I hope you get good news when you see the neuro guy on Wednesday and then can get to book to see the surgeon soon after. Flynn did have an anaesthetic for the CT as they have to keep perfectly still. Anaesthetic can be even more risky for pheo dogs as they can spike their BP, but they had an anaesthetist there for it just in case and he was fine.

Honestly, I think this is the worst time, waiting to get through all the testing and then to finally come up with a plan based on your veterinary experts advice. Once you know where you are headed you will feel a lot better. But this is a very stressful time for you so make sure you are looking after yourself won't you. Look for Skye's thread on her little beauty Shysie to read another adrenalectomy success story. I know you have read Patty's story about Fella, he is a little darling too and we were all absolutely gutted when he did not make it, but I think your vet quoting you 40% mortality is a little off the mark. From what I have read it is not that high it is more like 20% and it is such a crying shame that Fella was in that group and we are still holding him and Patty close. But I think it was also an awful reminder for us that the surgery is risky and you have to hope for the best but also be prepared if the worst does happen.

Here a few articles on adrenalectomy if you would like to read more, you may have already seen them.

http://www.vsso.org/Adrenal_Cortical_Tumor.html
http://histovetsdhv.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/adrenal-tumor.pdf
http://www.vsso.org/Adrenal_Pheochromocytoma.html
http://www.vetsurgerycentral.com/oncology_adrenal_tumors.html

Keep coming back to talk to us!
Trish :)

Rfeniolo

05-27-2013, 08:30 PM

Hello forum friends. Hope you are all having a blessed and restful Memorial Day weekend.
I was able to get some more information on Tigger's tests, etc. so here is what I found out.
Tigger's adrenal gland mass is in the left side and is 3x2x2-1/2. My vet says size was is not large but is large when you compare it to the pea size of her adrenal gland. It did show some mineralization which typically suggests a more aggressive mass. When she had the 8 hr test for cushings, she did not suppress at all. Started out at 6.7, then
5.1 and then 5. Her ALT has been elevated for at least 3 yrs and is pretty much staying the same but her AlkPhos is newly elevated at almost 1,200. She does have a heart murmur and moderate heart enlargement & potential enlargement In lymph nodes in front of her heart but it could just be fat. Her right side has a small nodule but doesn't look cancerous or threatening. Tiggy pants, loves to eat, & has a pot bellied looking abdomen but is not showing real significant cushings symptoms at this point which the vet thinks considering she hasn't suppressed at all and tumor is good. I asked about her expected lifespan and she said 15 would be good but really anything over 12 for her breed is a gift. She still has that funny gait and is going back to neurologist on wed morning for a recheck. Again he is feeling that the gait is unrelated to the cushings and coming from her neck (possibly stroke like event in neck, slipped disc, tumor... Really unknown).
So at this point, vet say last checked did not look like it was invading any vessels, etc but if the suggestion of its aggressiveness is accurate, it can become inoperable soon.
My question is this: given this info. And Tig's age, though their really is no "right" or "wrong" answer, How many of you personally would go forward with the surgery and who would not?? (Putting the financial factor aside).

Rfeniolo

05-27-2013, 08:48 PM

P.S. and thank-you Trish for Tigger's happy birthday wishes! That put a smile on my face!

Trish

05-28-2013, 06:25 AM

Hi! Hope you had a nice long weekend :)

That is a really hard question and is the one I think you would have to ask your surgeon. I did that, I asked him... if Flynn was your dog would you do this and gave him a good hard look in the eyes and I could tell by his answer that he truthfully thought it would be worth giving it a shot.

So I am afraid I am going to have to sit on the fence for this one and again say I would get him to surgeon for their opinion and advice. I know my local vet had not seen many (if any) dogs with this type of tumour and so I really went on advice from the surgeon and I would suggest you do the same. Some of us have dogs that have had various treatments for our dogs and those decisions were made once based on our individual dog and they are all so different and therefore its vital you go on what the specialists say! Has your local vet sent a referral to the surgeons, do you have an appointment in the pipeline?

Hope it goes well at the neurologists, be good to have a clearer picture of what was going on with the walking. I will have to leave the interpreting of the LDDS to those with more experience with cushings as I never had to deal with that in my boy.

Trish :)

Rfeniolo

05-28-2013, 09:50 AM

Good Morning All
My vet is calling Tufts veterinary to see if I can get a consult appt with Tigger this week. Keeping our fingers n paws crossed. It's a 2 hr trip for us but hopefully will be worth the trip.
Will keep you posted on the neurosurgeon appt tmrw too.

molly muffin

05-28-2013, 08:16 PM

Hope all goes well tomorrow with the neurosurgeon. I know this is a very hard decision to make and there are so many factors to be considered. Age of course is one. I'd also ask, what is the prognosis if you don't do the surgery vs if you do. Anything to give you enough information to come to an informed decision.
Crossing fingers!
Sharlene and Molly Muffin

frijole

05-28-2013, 09:06 PM

Good luck! Ask about the location of the tumor relative to the vena cava and any other obstacles the surgeon sees re removal. Ask about his experience with this type of case - not just any tumor - this type/size/location. Look him straight in the eyes and ask what he would do if it were his dog. Then listen intently and go with your gut. I wish it were simpler. Sending prayers and warm thoughts, Kim

Buffaloe

05-28-2013, 10:00 PM

I agree with Kim, you want to know the size of the tumor and its involvement with area blood vessels. You want to get a feel for how many similar adrenalectomies s/he has performed and the long term success rate. Tumors in the left gland are generally easier to remove than in the right gland. You need to feel comfortable with and believe in the surgeon. I know it is really difficult but try to hang in there tough. Ken

Trish

05-29-2013, 08:25 AM

Hi! Popping in to wish you luck for the neurologist appointment tomorrow, hope he finds some simple reason like a tweaked neck muscle that is causing the funny walking. I have noticed Flynn do a few stumbles but they were in the postop recovery period. I never saw any preop. Hope they settle right down! Glad to hear that referral has gone through to... you are onto it!!

Will be looking in tomorrow night to hear the update!
Trish :)

Trish

06-01-2013, 07:41 PM

I know I am a worrier with our adrenal tumour pups but how is Tigger doing, hope the appt with neurologist provided some answers. Hopefully you will get a chance over the weekend to provide an update! So hope all is going well for you two :):)

Rfeniolo

06-05-2013, 08:25 PM

So Tigger & I made our trip to Tufts yesterday and I am feeling discouraged as I feel at least just as confused before we went. I really was hoping for better news or some clear cut info that would determine what to do regarding surgery. They set me up with the internist that specialize in endocrinology. Initially, she was saying that there was no need to rush into surgery an maybe to treat medically was a good idea and then in the future considering surgery perhaps. Then, she took her in for an ultrasound (her first one was almost 4 wks prior). After the u/s she changed what she had been saying and said the tumor was large (about same size as it was 4 wks prior) and that time probably wasn't a luxury we have in deciding on surgery. She said she has a large mass on left adrenal gland and a smaller nodule on right gland. The said the left mass was pushing on vena cava but was no definite evidence of invasion.She also has a 3 out of 6 heart murmur. Her blood pressure was 160 when they checked it. I asked her if she would do surgery & she said she really didn't know. She left off that she was going to check with the surgical team and see what they thought but also said that surgeons usually always recommend surgery. She said she just didn't know with her age and other health problems but at the same time she said her tumor is like a ticking time bomb left inside her that you just don't know when it will erupt. I cannot bear the thought of losing her and keep thinking of precious little fella.

frijole

06-05-2013, 08:54 PM

Well crap. I was hoping you'd meet with the surgeon because frankly what she told you I COULD HAVE TOLD YOU. :D Did you find out the name of a specific surgeon that specializes in adrenal tumors? Push them for answers.

Otherwise Dr Peterson is in New York City. You could email him giving him specifics to see if he or anyone he knows could be of help. He's one of the top experts in the field.

http://www.animalendocrine.com/staff/dr-mark-e-peterson/

If you feel like you are just a number and not getting to the expert while at tufts then move on. Kim

molly muffin

06-05-2013, 09:01 PM

I agree with Kim. Crap. :( This really doesn't answer the questions that need to be answered. Such as what is their prognosis of outcome based on age and location of tumor and size too.
Every surgery has some risk, it is how much risk vs possible outcomes that you have to consider and they need to give you the right answers so you can make that decision.
I agree, if you come away without a positive feeling, then move on to someone else that can give you the answers you need. It is your call, how do you feel about it, about whom you met with, etc.

Hang in there
hugs,
Sharlene and Molly Muffin

Rfeniolo

06-05-2013, 10:04 PM

Thank you all for your feedback. Why does it seem like trying to see oz when trying to see a surgeon? I will keep you posted on what the surgical team thinks as soon as I hear back from them. In the meantime, thanks for dr. Perversions info. I think I will try to get his feelings on this. I think his Bedford hills office is only an hour and a half from home which is actually a little closer than tufts. Does anyone know anything about the nuclear imaging mentioned on his page? Curious.
Love from both me & Tiggy!

Rfeniolo

06-05-2013, 10:05 PM

I have to laugh, as I re-read my post, I see that my spell check really hacked dr. Petersons name.

frijole

06-05-2013, 10:20 PM

I was laughing hysterically... bet he has never been called that before. LOL Nuclear imaging is beyond my expertise. :D We have had dogs that had leading edge surgeries performed by leaders in the field. Dr. Perversion (LOL) is one of those guys. No doubt his office would have leading edge equipment. Kim

Trish

06-06-2013, 08:45 AM

haha autocorrect fail!!

So pleased to hear from you again! How frustrating that appointment sounds though. I also hope they are not wasting your money doing another ultrasound. I know my surgeon wanted a CT so they could clearly see involvement.

So what I am getting is the IMS is going to discuss Tigger with surgeon including his other health problems like heart murmer to see if surgery would be an option. Well we had kind of the same approach with my dog. But he had been under surveillance with regular ultrasounds and IMS review following a liver resection the previous year when they picked up the adrenal tumour. She did speak to surgeon as well to see if surgery was an option based on the ultrasound which he said it was then we only saw him and he wanted a CT which was done to check for and spread in abdomen, lungs etc and then it was all go. So I hope the chat between IMS and surgeon is speedy and they get back to you asap!!

Good news it has not grown in those four weeks though, think of Fella by all means as he is very dear to our hearts, but also think of Flynn and Shysie and Ken's doggie who have all got through adrenalectomies successfully.

Trish :)

Rfeniolo

06-07-2013, 10:30 AM

The surgeon from tufts called last night to discuss possibility of surgery for Tigger. He is recommending a cardiology work up and then a CT scan which my local vet has been reluctant to do as she seems very concerned about tiggy anesthetically. Her thinking was that if we were going to risk anesthesia, make it for the surgery itself rather than just for the test. He says that the second ultrasound did not clearly distinguish if the mass is invading vena cava. The feeling I got from him was that if it isn't invading, then surgery should be considered but if it is, he can do it but probably wouldn't recommend it bc of the increased risk and tigs age. They also want to get her started on trilostane to possibly make her a more stable surgical candidate. The surgeon would remove left gland and then clamp cut smaller right gland nodule. He said he feels it would be a 3-5% chance of losing her if vena cava not invaded. Is this just his percentage minus the anEsthesia risk %age?? I'm really stressing even just the anesthesia for CT scan. Would if I lose her for that? Does anyone know if it is a lighter anesthesia or is it same like surgery? Also, does this scan tell them if its a pheochromocytoma? That also would increase risk but he doesn't think that it is but can't say for sure. Also, he said potentially without the surgery, she may be able to live for a year. She is acting fine as of now with few cushings symptoms so my vet wasn't going to start her on meds until she showed more clinical symptoms. Btw, where did Fella have his surgery? And I called dr petersons office and they are not taking any new patients. Thank you all and wishing you a blessed day!

Budsters Mom

06-07-2013, 01:31 PM

Hi,:)
Sending love, prayers, and healing energy your way. I am so sorry that Tigger has been having so many serious issues. We are always be here to listen and help when we can.

Hugs,
Kathy

Trish

06-08-2013, 01:02 AM

Crikey... I have to wonder why they even did that 2nd ultrasound when the last one was only a month ago?!? Seems a waste of money to me!! Your local vet is saying to be concerned about anaesthetic for a CT when that is the best view they would get to be able to even plan whether the surgery is even a viable option in the first place!! You have seen local vet, referred to neurologist, endocrinologist, now cardiologist before surgeon even gets to decide if it is even possible!! Jeepers this is a very expensive business and a lot of money in vets pockets and I would be VERY annoyed if they finally decide after all this testing, scanning and appointments and expense that surgery is not safe!!! :confused:

My surgeon had a fairly clear view from the ultrasound that Flynn's tumour was most likely a pheochromocytoma as it arose from the medulla (centre) of the adrenal, whereas adrenocortical tumours arise from the cortex or the outer part of the gland. They could also see from the ultrasound the tumour thrombus in the vena cava. The CT confirmed it all and gave a clearer view plus they use it to search for any possible tumour spread as it is best there is no evidence of spread before embarking on surgery. Plus Flynn's BP was up, which was another clear sign of pheo. They cannot be absolutely sure though without the tissue diagnosis when they take it out.

I think after the cardiologist has put forward their opininion on whether it is safe or not for Tigger to proceed with surgery then you can decide on whether the CT is needed or not. If it is not safe to operate, I wonder whether proceeding with the medications would be indicated if Tigger has few cushing symptoms.

What happened at the neurologists? How is the stumbling going for Tigger, hopefully it has settled down.

I can feel your frustration as I am getting it too!!!! :eek::D:eek:

Really hope we get some answers for little Tigger soon
Trish :)

Rfeniolo

06-15-2013, 12:54 AM

Hello All. I took tigger in for her cardiology work up yesterday (EKG & cardio gram ultrasound) which was recommended by the surgeon. The results were not bad but did show a leaky valve ( I think left) which is causing her stage 3 heart murmur. They did think that she can go forward with the anesthesia so long they are careful. However, today tigger was breathing very fast & was making a snoring or wheezing type sound. I took her in to be on safe side where they did an x ray, pulse ox, & blood pressure. Nothing looked alarming as vet said she could have thrown a clot to her lungs. She is home now & isn't eating like usual. She usually has a ravenous appetite but today she is passing up food for the most part. This concern me. I am extremely nervous. The plan is to start her on trilostane on Monday morning( a low dose to start), check her levels in 2 wks, then do CT scan. If CT scan shows that tumor has not invaded vena cava, then surgery will be scheduled soon after. If it shows that it has, surgery will not be done. Any thoughts?

Trish

06-15-2013, 08:35 PM

Hi :)
I hope Tigger's breathing is good today and she is eating better, such a worry when they go off their food. Poor wee thing.

I would be worried a little if she is off colour starting the Trilistane as from what I read on that drug you need to watch closely for any symptoms like loss of appetite, diarrhea etc to see if she is reacting badly.

If she is not suitable for surgery are they saying they would continue with the Trilostane anyway? I remember you saying she does not have many cushings symptoms. Do they think it will help the tumour? I say this because if they are ONLY starting the Trilostane for surgery I would want to know why do it when we are still not clear whether surgery will proceed. Personally I would have wanted the CT to see where Tigger stands and the answer to whether surgery was even an option before doing all this testing and now starting her on drugs. Maybe your vets have a good reason for all of this.

I hope she has perked up today and is feeling better, I can understand your anxiety and am sending you lots of hugs. :)

Rfeniolo

06-20-2013, 04:59 PM

Tigger is gone. I am so devastated & heartbroken. As I last wrote, she was scheduled to have a cardiology work up last thurs. I took her and they said she has a leaky valve which is why she has the murmur but seen nothing alarming. No diet, meds or exercise restriction is needed. The very next day, fri. She began breathing fast. I took her in to vet and they checked her spo2 stats 3 times, her blood pressure and did x ray to see if she was bleeding but she wasn't so they sent her home w me. She continued to breathe rapidly all weekend and do she saw the vet again on tues night. She said her lungs sounded congested & she gave her a lasiks injectable & baytril injectable (I only had just started her on trilostane the day before but didn't give it to her tues as she wouldn't really eat). I was then supp to give her lasiks pill later on that night after the vet left and I thought I got it in her mouth only to find it in her bed the next morning. By yesterday, she was not eating, breathing fast and coughing more. I took her to vet for oxygen and an injectable lasiks where she went into cardiac arrest. They were doing CPR and asked if they should continue but my vet didn't feel that it was best. It all happened so fast and really a week ago today she was fine. I don't know why she suddenly started breathing fast on fri and why we didn't do more to help her. I feel that this crisis could have been avoided and I'm so angry at myself that I left her like that for 6 days. And now she's gone and maybe I should have let them continue CPR. She may have gotten through this. My poor precious girl. She was wagging her tail just yesterday morning & trying so hard to do all of her cute tiggy things. I miss her soooo much already am so heartbroken and I can't live with the way this past week went knowing we could have done more.

Squirt's Mom

06-20-2013, 06:43 PM

Oh, honey, I am so so sorry to hear this. I know you are heart broken but you are not at fault. You have been doing all you could to help your sweet girl and she knows it as well as we do. If the mass invaded the vena cava, there was little that could be done unfortunately and these masses don't always let us know they are there until they are quite large. As soon as you knew, you took action to get her the best help you could - no one could ask more. I know Tigger doesn't blame you in the least.

Tigger's name has been added to the In Loving Memory thread for 2013 where she will always be remembered by her family here. In time, I hope you will feel up to starting a memorial thread for her in the In Loving Memory section, sharing your memories of your life together, allowing us to help celebrate her life.

Please keep talking to us. We will be here to listen anytime of the day or night. You don't walk alone now - all you need to do is reach out and you will find a host of hands reaching back.

Our deepest sympathies,
Leslie, Squirt, Trinket, Brick, Sophie, Josie and our Angels, Ruby, Crystal and Tasha

FRIEND

I lost a treasured friend today
The little dog who used to lay
Her gentle head upon my knee
And shared her silent thoughts with me.

She’ll come no longer to my call
Retrieve no more her favourite ball
A voice far greater than my own
Has called her to his golden throne.

Although my eyes are filled with tears
I am thankful for the happy years
She spent down here with me
And for her love and loyalty.

When it is time for me to go
And join her there, this much I know
I shall not fear the transient dark
For she will greet me with a bark.

~Author Unknown

Boriss McCall

06-20-2013, 07:06 PM

I have not posted on your thread yet. but, I have read everything. I just want you to know we are here for you. I know how difficult it is. I went thru almost the exact same thing last July with my Min-Pin. Except she did not have cushings. She just had a heart murmur like Tigger & started breathing really hard one evening. We did everything you did. We left her over night. I had to rush to the vet because she went into cardiac arrest & was passing on. I got there just in time to hold her & say goodbye. I know exactly how you feel. I was in panic mode & they were telling me it was not a good idea to try to bring her back. When everything happens so fast like that it is just unbelievable.
I know you are thinking about all the what if's right now. But, just know you did everything you possibly could for your baby. I am so sad for you.
big hugs to you.. I know your heart is heavy.

Simba's Mom

06-20-2013, 08:08 PM

So sorry to hear about your Tigger, no more vets and tests and struggles, only wings to fly....you did the best you could for Tigger, lots of people I know would not have done half the stuff you did for your sweet Tigger, you are a great Momma...sending hugs!

Roxee's Dad

06-20-2013, 08:15 PM

Oh Dear, I am so very sorry. Rest in Peace Sweet Tigger, Tonight you are our newest and brightest star in the sky .......

Trixie

06-20-2013, 09:19 PM

I'm so sorry to hear your news about your Tigger. I'm certain you gave Tigger a wonderful life and lots of love. That's what counts. It's a sad loss for you...we're all here to listen when you need to talk.
Barbara

Rfeniolo

06-20-2013, 09:43 PM

Thank you all. I am so grateful I have each one of you. I would like to have a picture of tiggy on here but I don't know how to do it.

Roxee's Dad

06-20-2013, 10:25 PM

To have Tigger as you avatar.. go to
User control Panel (User CP) in upper left corner of this page.
Go to Edit Use profile
Click on "Use Custom Avatar"

Then just upload your picture from your computer.

To make an album of Tigger pictures do the same but click on Pictures and albums instead of edit avatar. Then create an album and upload pictures of Tigger.

Looking forward to seeing her.

frijole

06-20-2013, 10:32 PM

I'm so sorry! It sounds like most of the issues were heart related and don't be hard on yourself - You did everything you could and more. Tigger is now free of the adrenal tumor and heart problems and is running free of all pain and worries. RIP dearest Tigger. Run with the wind and look down on your dear mom who loves you very much. Kim

Budsters Mom

06-20-2013, 11:36 PM

I am so sorry to hear that sweet Tigger has passed over rainbow bridge. My deepest condolences go out to you and your family.:( Tigger knows how much you love her and all you did for her. She is eternally grateful as she runs free, soaring in the wind.
((((((((((((((Hugs))))))))))))))))
Kathy

molly muffin

06-20-2013, 11:51 PM

Oh no. :( I just read about Tigger passing. What a very long hard week you had.

I don't know if there is anything more that you could have done. These adrenal masses can cause things to go wrong very quickly sometimes, if they think that is what caused this. The BP often goes up with these masses too and then having a leaky valve could have complicated it. It's always hard to know for sure, but I think you did everything you could.

Try not to blame yourself, you did everything you could.

hugs,
Sharlene and Molly Muffin

doxiesrock912

06-21-2013, 01:31 AM

I am so sorry for your loss!

Please never blame yourself, we do what we can but veterinary medicine isn't "all knowing" and some things just can't be predicted.

Tigger knew love and that is what's most important.

Trish

06-21-2013, 03:41 AM

Oh no, I am so gutted for you to read this. Your poor thing after all you have done for Tigger. This is just heartbreaking and I grieve with you that this has happened to your wee girl. You were so strong letting her go when you had to, you have done all you could for your Tigger and more. I want to see her picture too, RIP little Tigger you were a much loved girl and will leave a big hole in the hearts of all those that loved you. Please keep coming in and talking to us, I do think it helps to talk to all of us who care so very much xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Rfeniolo

06-21-2013, 02:48 PM

The tears just won't stop flowing. I keep thinking I should have had them continue CPR and maybe she would have gotten through this. I never really got a chance to say goodbye. I was not in the room with her but I keep feeling I wished I had them continue CPR. She was the last piece of my "former" life with my husband who passed away 4 yrs ago. She never left me through so many good & bad times. Not sure how I'm going to get along without her to make me smile and all of her perfect & cute loving ways.

Trish

06-21-2013, 05:57 PM

Oh how I feel for you, I think it is so hard to make the call to stop CPR. But deep down I think when it has got to that stage it is time to say, right that is enough we have tried everything and as hard as it is but you had to do that for Tigger.

She would have run over that rainbow bridge and found your hubby and have been so happy to see him....:). But it is so sad for you, please try and think of the happy times when you were all together. The connection we have with our babies goes through walls you know, even though you were not with her physically she knew you only ever did the best for her. Sending lots of hugs :)

molly muffin

06-21-2013, 06:12 PM

Oh sweetie I just cry to think of what you are going through right now. It's tough to ever lose them, it is harder when you aren't there. Then throw in that this was a link with your husband who passed and I know it is just heart wrenching.
I really don't think that you could have done any more than you did. It is not easy to let them go, it is one of the hardest things we can do as pet parents.
I just don't know that her little body could have survived this episode, no matter what you did or didn't do.
I'm very, very sorry for your heart pain. Please do remember though that the love doesn't go away, it is always there. That is how we all live on later after we are gone, is in the hearts of those who loved us best.

hugs,
Sharlene and Molly Muffin