A Potential Diagnosis - A Great Concern (6.5 y/o australian shepherd mix)

[tpetrone]

Hi There,

My 6.5 year old australian shepard mix has recently began undergoing a lot of testing. She has had blood drawn where here levels that were supposed to be in the 400-600 range came back in the 4,000 range. She does have a pot bellied appearance, and she had low thryroid activity. We went back to the vet this morning to give a urine sample and retest her blood. He is leaning towards potential cushings disease but also testing the liver.

I am a bit of a worryer. But with this new situation I am absolutely terrified. Like most pet owners, I look at my dog like my own child, however I live many miles from family and friends and besides my dog I am alone. the thought of loosing her is beyond terrifying and my greatest fear. I understand this could happen eventually, but I planned on another 6-8 years with her before we had to face some thing liek this.

I know this is just the beginning and I trust my vet and have a great deal of faith in him. He was the first to bring up testing even though she has been seen by other vets, he also helped me cure a sick cat awith 6 months of treatment successfully. I was wondering if you had any advice. I have read a tremendous amount of articles, and understand that variations of how the disease exsists and they different types of treatment.

My greatest concern is that treating the disease is concern just a managibility of it. And to promote quality of life not longer life. I miss the dog who got excited to run around outside and didn't slowly trail behind me on a walk. I don't want to see her panting for no reason and able to jump on furniture again. She has been healthy up until recently and I believe that she was "just getting older" but now all she does is sleep or lay around. she gets excited for food and treats, but she doesn't really play with a toy anymore, or even chase our cats. Will treatment change this? Can she get her personality back?

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[addy]

Hi and Welcome,

I am so glad you found your way here. We all arrive rather shell shocked and worried, afraid. Perfectly normal. Now that you have us, you will never really be alone again. We are here to hold your hand, listen, support you. Whatever you may need.

We ask a LOT of questions, so dont be worried about that. Cushings is very hard to diagnosis and no one test is perfect. You may be refering to the UC:CR creatinine test which can rule out Cushings or indicate further testing. If you could post any tests along with the normal ranges, indicating the abnormal reading, that would be great.

The drugs used to treat the disease are serious drugs and can give our pups a quality of life. Sometimes it will depend on whether or not there are other underlying conditions.

But then, we are putting the cart before the horse a bit. You have time to learn as much as you can about the disease and treatments options.

Glad you found us. Take a deep breath and we will help sort things out.

[tpetrone]

Hi there everyone! I am Delilah's mom and a little over a month ago Delilah was diagnosed with Cushings. She had very high cortisol levels and our dex supression tests confirmed cushings. We have started on 120 mg of Vetoryl daily, it seems high but in relation to her levels I think this is right. My vet wants to explore lowering the dosage after a little while.

Let me start off by saying my vet has far exceeded my expectations. He caught the symptoms the first time he met Delilah and helped me through the diagnosis process. We have done many blood tests, urine tests, kidney tests and dex supression tests so I am confident in his diagnosis and prognosis.

After a few weeks of vetoryl I have noticed a huge difference in Delilah, she is alert and happy. She isn't just lying on the floor panting and over eating anymore. She is even playing again! She is enjoying her walks and excited. This is more than I could have hoped for, I am so estatic to have her former behavior back.

Now I come to my question! For other Cushing's mommies do you have any remedies for upset tummies from vetoryl? Delilah takes Pepcid AC per my vet 30 minutes before the Vetoryl and she seems good most of the day, but at night I notice some grass eating and I think that it is upsetting her stomache. Does anyone have any advice? Her bowl movements are good and her kidney and liver tests are good too. I think its something along the lines of heartburn from medicine.

I read a scoop of plain yogurt? I would only do this at night when she starts to head towards the grass. It's usually after she eats her dinner. I am really looking for an inexpensive remedy to settle her stomache. Any suggestions? :D

MODERATOR NOTE - I have merged this post concerning tummy aches with Delilah's original thread. We like to keep all information about each pup in one place. That way it is easier to look back through the history if needed. Thanks!

[tpetrone]

I will give my 20 questions up front:

What dose of Vetoryl is she taking and how many times a day?
-120 mg once a day

What prompted the testing for Cushing's in the first place?
-brought her in for a swollen gland on her lip, the vet noticed the pot belly, hair getting wirey, started asking questions about food and weight gain. I thought she was just getting older....After a few days of observations I did realize how much she was panting, and how big the behavior changes were.


What signs were you seeing prior to starting treatment other than the muscle weakness and loss of balance?
-Prior to treatment I saw excessive water consumption. She would lay against the tile like she was knocked out panting, and making weird grunting/breathing noises. She lacked energy always, couldn't even really make it around the block on a walk anymore without slowing severely. She was eating a lot, her belly became huge, gained 20 lbs. Her hair was wirey when it had always been soft and silky. She started to not even want to jump on the bed at night, this is when Is started getting really concerned.


What tests were done to diagnose the Cushing's?
-We had blood tests, dex suppression tests, liver tests and urine analysis. Her levels were in the 4000's when they should have been 0, some of which I acrue to fear.

Does she have any other health issues? If so, what?
-Other than this she had always been a healthy dog, one swollen gland on her mouth nothing crazy.

Is she on any other meds, supplements, or herbs? If so, what are they, for what conditions, how much and how often dose she take them?
-She is not currently, we are looking into some doggie glucosomine as per my vet it might be at that age to start looking into it. She takes Pepcid AC for stomache since started taking vetoryl.

Did the vet tell you what to look for that indicate the cortisol is dropping too low?
-My vet has kept me very informed, we have already gone back for a 3 week dex supression test and will probably go back in a few more weeks for another. He stools are good, she is a completely differnt dog with energy, she is so much less lethargic. The first thing I would notice is loss of appetite, she loves her food and she eats at very speciffic times for her, she created the routine. She doens't like to eat unless i am home and have eaten.

If you need any other info let me know!

[labblab]

Hello and welcome to you and Delilah!

We are so glad you've found us and joined our family. :)

And thanks so much for all the info you've already given us. That is super helpful. It is wonderful that you are seeing so much improvement in Delilah already, and that you have such a great relationship with your vet. That can make all the difference in the world when you are facing a scary diagnosis and major changes in your dog.

I do have a couple additional questions for you, though. You've told us that Delilah had "suppression tests" performed prior to starting treatment (LDDS, HDDS?). You also mention a monitoring dex suppression test three weeks into treatment. The necessary test for monitoring Vetoryl treatment is the ACTH stimulation test, and not the LDDS (low dose dex suppression). The LDDS can only be used for initial diagnostic purposes, not to make dosing decisions once the medication is started. So I want to clarify with you as to which test was performed at that three-week mark. Also, if you can give us the actual numerical results for any and all LDDS/HDDS/ACTH tests, that would be very helpful.

Also, I am curious as to how much Delilah weighs. The starting dose that Dechra (Vetoryl manufacturer) currently recommends is a forumula of 1 mg. per pound. That initial dosing range is based upon the weight of the dog, and not the magnitude of the cortisol elevation. So unless Delilah is a pretty big girl, that starting dose of 120 mg. is indeed a larger one. That is why I am really interested in finding out what the actual results were for that first 3-week monitoring test. It's possible that Delilah's indigestion is resulting from a dose that is a bit higher than is comfortable for her. When cortisol levels are brought down to a much lower level in a very short amount of time, dogs can suffer from some discomfort.

As far as the discomfort, I don't know whether you can give the Pepcid twice a day? Perhaps that is something you can ask your vet, or maybe some of our other members will have had experience with this.

Once again, welcome, and thanks in advance for this additional info!

Marianne

[Squirt's Mom]

For the tummy upset, you can also try some fresh ginger root. Just a small bite should help, if she will eat it. Organic yogurt can sometimes helps but it can also sometimes cause diarrhea as not all pups can handle diary products well. My Squirt was on the Pepcid AC for a while and it lost its effectiveness so we switched to Tagamet and it has worked for her for some time now. But she only needs it on her dosing days (she is on Lysodren).

Like Marianne said, it would really help to see the test results, and the names of the testing done to monitor since being on Vetoryl. If the LDDS is really the test that has been done to monitor treatment, then I fear you have been wasting your money. ;) But, other than the digestive upset, it does sound as if her signs are improving. Keep a close eye just in case this upset is a precursor to the cortisol dropping way too low. You would see loss of appetite, diarrhea, and extreme lethargy, to the point you think he is passing, if this were to occur.


Her levels were in the 4000's when they should have been 0...

What does this level refer to? Was this the only abnormal value (too high or too low)?

Good to hear from you again!
Hugs,
Leslie and the gang