Montana, 12 y/o Frenchbulldog - (update: Montana has passed)

[raeandmontana]

Hi Kathy, et all,
i am new to this site and i wanted to ask you a few things.
my dog is 12 and an adorable, loveable frenchbulldog. she has always had terrible allergies. i've tried homeopathic approach and allopathic. nothing has seemed to work to resolve it entirely. but shes managed to be a happy dog and pretty healthy i think since i care for her really well. I feed her quality dog food (i feed her natures logic raw, some veggies and never any grains or crappy foods). she has appeared and behaved very healthy apart from those nasty allergy symptoms like scratching/hotspots and ear infections. things seemed to get a little bit cleared up until about two years ago when she got a uti and started drinking a lot (figured from the uti). antibiotics seemed to clear it up but then about 6mos later it came back again. And after that one, she has started consistently drinking a lot. ive noticed it but her peeing wasnt problematic and she seemed healthy overall. But three weeks ago she got another UTI and since then in the past two weeks she has been peeing a LOT more than ever (needing to go out 1 to 2 times at night even). one weird thing: she doesnt want to lay down quickly on our bed at night, it takes her a while. we thought/think maybe she has pulled her back from walking up our 2 steps so much going pee up to 12x day. but not sure. in these same few weeks her hind legs seem to be giving out on her. like they are weak. she never liked walks much but in the past month she will NOT walk whatsoever. so i know something has been going wrong for the past month or so but with this uti/urine/water drinking thing ii am really thinking it's cushings. So basically this is the 4th UtI in two years. seems to be occuring a lot. meanwhile, an important situation to add is that she got a really bad skin condition last summer which i tried to treat holistically but that never worked so eventually it required anitibitiotics in December. her left hind limb got so swollen she could hardly walk! deep infection. after antibiotics kicked in and i dsicovered a very good antibacteriall shampoo (and still use every other day on her), that resolved skin condition. They did do lots of tests back then b/c i asked my vet could it be cushings. but vet didnt do a true cushings test bc her "whatever" levels which would be clear indication of cushins wasnt elevated at all.... well now i read your posts and see someone says that this can be misleading, and im concerned that he didnt do a true cushings test!! so he will do the test on monday (again, he makes me wait!!). Q. what tests do i need to make sure he does, do you know? im scared to find out if it is cushings, but i almost think it is b/c of all the symptoms. anyway, i digress. Q. what is the situation with Honey? how is she doing? what are you doing to make her feel better? how old is she and so forth? i am so scared right now. my montana is my life, my love, my world. i feel i am losing her. she doesnt play hardly at all anymore, she is a stoic dog and tolerates pain to a fault. she has gone gradually deaf (from previous ear infections) and so she is limited in this way which makes me sad. Now this constant drinking is freaking me out! Oh---forgot to mention, i told vet she doesnt seem to be getting better with this UTI since she is still drinking/peeing so much and asked for new tests to be taken of her blood and urine. and the blood just came back today and vet said her ATL is high like 240 (two weeks ago it was 99) and so he is concerned with her liver enzymes. obviously something is wrong. the antibiotics cleared up the bacteria he said but still some of the results are not out yet... meanwhile i dont know what to do for her. he finally will do a test of cushings. Q. i am freaked out am i too late in the disease stage to get her back to good health? is it too far gone if she's drinking so much and her liver is high enzymes and her legs are weak? she is restless, just walks around like a zombie. i miss her so much, she seems so far away from me lately. Q. should i go ahead and get her that Q10 supplement, etc. etc. what do you recommend? Q. do you think the natures logic raw is still a good food to be feeding her?
i ask all these questions because i havent found a really knowledgeable vet to deal with all of her issues.
-----this post is for anyone knowledgeable about the subject, pls feel free to respond------

[labblab]

Hello Rae and Montana,

I saw that you had posted this reply on another member's thread, but I want our members to have the opportunity to reply to you directly. So I have copied your reply in order to create a brand new thread for you and Montana. Welcome to you both, and I'm certain that others will soon be by to welcome you, too, and also to offer you their support and feedback.

Marianne

[StarDeb55]

Welcome to you & Montana! Before I answer your questions, I must ask have you considered taking Montana to a vet dermatologist. I have had 2 dogs, now, with severe allergies which included repeated ear infections, & the only vet that finally got things under control was a derm vet.

Now, on to your questions, my response will be in blue.


Q. what tests do i need to do, to make sure it is/it is not cushings, do you know? im scared to find out if it is cushings, but i almost think it is b/c of all the symptoms. also-
A good initial screening test that is inexpensive is a urine cortisol creatinine ratio, UCCR for short. You could even collect the urine at home, the first morning pee is the preferred sample. If this test is negative, you can totally rule out Cushing's. Positive means Cushing's is a possibility, further testing required. If it's positive, you will then need to proceed to either a low dose dex suppression test or an ACTH. The low dose test is considered to be the gold standard to diagnose Cushing's, but it has one huge problem in that it can yield a false positive result in the presence of non-adrenal illness. It is very important, since Cushing's is probably the most difficult of all canine diseases to diagnose that you do a second test to confirm a positive low dose or ACTH. A lot of us had abdominal ultrasounds done to take a look at the adrenal glands, the ultrasound will also give you more "bang for your buck" as it will let you see all of Montana's internal organs to get a better picture of her overall health.


Q. Oh---is UTI not healing a symptom of Cushings? she doesnt seem to be getting better with this UTI this time around, which is my main reason for concern at this point. the vet decided to give her "convenia" shot and insists it should work, according to her urine results she is senstive to it. But she is still drinking/peeing so much! and not acting well. So asked a few days ago for new tests to be taken of her blood and urine. BAD NEWS: The blood just came back today and vet said her liver ATL is high ---like 240 (just two weeks ago right before the antibiotic shot was given, it was 99). obviously something is wrong. i am so scared. vet says some of the tests have come back and the antibiotics cleared up the bacteria but waiting on some of the other urine results still... meanwhile i dont know what to do for her. he finally will do a test of cushings.
Cushing's suppresses a pup's immune system, so repeated infections that are difficult to treat or slow to heal are a common symptom.


Q. i am freaked out am i too late in the disease stage to get her back to good health? is it too far gone if she's drinking so much and her liver is high enzymes and her legs are weak? she is restless, just walks around like a zombie. i miss her so much, she seems so far away from me lately. what can i do meanwhile, just in case it is cushings?
Not to worry, Cushing's is a very slowly progressing disease literally taking years to its damage to a pup's internal organs. The high liver enzymes, drinking gallons, & peeing buckets are very common symptoms for all of are pups, & are usually what will cause a parent to take a pup to the vet. Assuming it's Cushing's, your baby can live her full lifespan with a good quality of life by treating with either of the 2 medications, lysodren or trilostane. My 1st boy, Barkley, was successfully treated with lysodren for nearly 8 years, finally crossing the bridge at 15 from causes unrelated to his Cushing's. (Yes, I've been lucky enough to have to take care of 2 Cushpups in the past 10 years or so.)


Q. should i go ahead and get her milk thistle? coQ10 supplement? has anyone tried Supraglan? what do you recommend? can i do these things while waiting to see if its cushings?
A lot of members do give their pups milk thistle for liver support. Please discuss this with your vet prior to starting any supplements for Montana. You can forget Supraglan & all these other miracle, natural, homeopathic cures that you find on the web. They are nothing but snake oil & a rip off. If any of them worked, we would all have our pups using them in a flash.


Q. do you think the natures logic raw is still a good food to be feeding her? its about 25% protein and has a lot of water in it so i heard that is fine. i fear changing her food now b/c its finally a food that she seems to tolerate and not aggravate allergies.
Right now, with Montana's allergy situation, IMO, I would not change her food.

It would help us tremendously if you could get copies of all the testing that has been done so far & post the actual numbers for us. Please include the reporting units, & normal ranges. We only need to see the abnormal results. We are especially interested in the liver function tests such as alkaline phosphatase, ALT, cholesterol, AST. The urine specific gravity result would also be good.

Again, welcome to both of you! We are here to help in any way we can. We can help you get all of this sorted out, & guide you on a good path to take to get a reliable diagnosis. The best thing you can do is learn all you can about Cushing's, as you're Montana's voice & only advocate. You might want to take a look at our important information section where you will find tons of links that will lead you to just about any info you might want on cushing's.

Debbie

[Harley PoMMom]

Hi Rae,

Welcome to you and Montana, so glad you found us and we will help you in any way we can.

Debbie has given you a lot of really good advice so I will try not to repeat what Debbie has already mentioned.

Cushing's can be a very difficult disease to get a confirmed diagnosis. But since it is a slow progressing disease one does have the time to get a proper diagnosis.

UTI's are common with Cush pups and since Montana has an UTI that is recurring I would suggest that a culture and sensitivity test be performed. The culture and sensitivity test pinpoints the type of bacteria that is causing the infection. Based on this test, your vet will be able to prescribe the appropriate antibiotic/s for that particular bacteria.

Stress and non-adrenal illnesses will cause the cortisol to elevate so until the UTI is resolved, IMO, no Cushing testing should be done.

I was wondering if non-adrenal illnesses such as diabetes and thyroid problems have been ruled out. Both of these illnesses share some of the same symptoms as Cushing disease.

Please know we are here to support you and we will walk this journey with you. Also, please feel free to ask all the questions you want.

Here are some links which I hope will be useful: Links to Cushings Websites (especially helpful for new members!). ( http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/showthread.php?t=180) and Helpful Resources for Owners of Cushing's Dogs. (http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=&f=10)

Love and hugs,
Lori

[raeandmontana]

thank you both!!
i have to reread it and then i might post more answers in a day or so.

but first off, omgosh how helpful of you to suggest the tests to be done in order! he was just going to start with the blood test. i will definately ask for the urine culture then... i just forwarded the suggested test plan to my vet.

We did get lots of tests done by the way, i will forward to you. And we did get the fancy urine test/ultrasound etc. etc. two weeks ago which i can forward to you. And in December we saw a dermatologist, who finally, after all these years, helped us resolve her skin problem. one biggie to resolve it, as i stated, is giving her baths (nearly daily) with trizchlor 4 shampoo. it works like a miracle on her once red/sticky/infected skin. re: her ears im not sure if she could be experiencing an inner ear infection but for the outer ears i clean now with 1/2 vinegar and water and it seems to have stopped infections for about 3 years now. (but i wonder if a chronic inner ear infection is causing her listlessness sometimes). i should go get that checked with the derm lady soon.

Lori u mention to not test for cushings till her UTI is resolved but the culture for bacteria did come back and shows no bacteria anymore so i assume that means its okay to test for cushings? Yes she is still drinking/peeing alot but that might not mean she still has a UTI based on the tests. (the tests are incomplete, vet waiting for final results monday).

so for right now i wont change her food or try any supplements without talking to my vet. i will reread these posts later and add the info for you to review as well.

thank you thank you thank you! mucho appreciated. Montana is a JEWEL of a dog. i have a 2 yr old girl who adores her and they are like peas in a pod... she's the most gentle doggie soul i've ever met.

[Harley PoMMom]

A dog suffering from chronic ear infections can be indication of Hypothyroidism. Has this illness be ruled out?

[raeandmontana]

yes i've asked this very question too, as i read about it. i am convinced this is it but every vet says results show it isnt. maybe you can read between the lines better than them!
here are the tests done and results:

july 2011 ----- T4 1.6
dec 2010 ----- T4 1.4 TSHLEVEL 0.38 FREE T4 21
aug 2008 ----- T4 1.6
dec 2007 ----- T4 2.4 FREE T4 31
feb 2007 ----- T4 3.2 TSH LEVEL 0.13 FREE T4 20
july 2006 ----- T4 darn it the page is missing from my records!

i notice above the T4 is lowering. she is a VERY mellow dog. never liked walks much. bad skin infections and ear infections.

[raeandmontana]

okay everyone so i just bought milk thistle under advice of my vet. i will begin on this tomorrow.

the urine test for cortisol will be given for testing on monday, thanks debbie!

lori and harley, thx for the thyroid reminder. i will show my vet the changes in value of her thyroid tests to take note. (i really think this is an issue for her but no one else does!).

also vet suggests giving her the Denisol SAMe to help her aching joints and now, the liver, which i never gave her alone but with the dasuquin (this was for arthritis protocol), when i gave the dasuquin to her in december and then in just three weeks ago it made her have diarrhea and then suddenly she got a UTI! this happened twice so it seems not coincidental. i think it was the dasuquin and not the denisol that upset her stomach... but not sure.

so with this issue of UTIs and sensitive tummy, should i give her the SAMe now or wait a week or so? i am so torn. im not even convinced the SAMe is all that great, it's so artificial and i read there arent conclusive tests showing it helps all that much for the arthritis. it might help her liver right? the milk thistle might be enough for time being?

test results of all stuff coming up over weekend..... thanks for all your help folks!! big doggie kisses!

[StarDeb55]

Can you please post the normal ranges for all of the thyroid testing that you posted earlier?

Thanks.
Debbie

[raeandmontana]

yes!

T4 -- 1.0-4.0
TSH LEVEL -- 0.00-0.60
FREE T4 -- 8-40

again the results were as follows:
july 2011 ----- T4 1.6
dec 2010 ----- T4 1.4 TSHLEVEL 0.38 FREE T4 21
aug 2008 ----- T4 1.6
dec 2007 ----- T4 2.4 FREE T4 31
feb 2007 ----- T4 3.2 TSH LEVEL 0.13 FREE T4 20
july 2006 ----- T4 page is missing the very last line

[raeandmontana]

i feel like a hypochondriac for montana.
its 4am and i cant sleep because she woke me trembling. i feel her head and its trembling. she also didn't want to lie down after i took her out to pee (yes 4am). she was sitting up in bed for a long while. putting some pieces together. unless this is a symptom of Cushings, i think she is getting an inner ear infection, or vestibular disease-
-trembling in head area
-sensitive around jaw/ear area when touched she shakes her head
-wont lay head down without hesitation. sits up for a minute first.
-recent lack of coordination, wide based stance, back legs falling.
-ears drooping a little, one more than the other, mostly during evenings or when tired
- She used to do the “dead dog trick” and wont do it for me lately at all. (maybe causes dizziness?)

btw i think she is permanently deaf. it has been a gradual thing. getting worse and worse past two years and now i think she hears nothing. sad. it started when she got a bad ear infection (2005). she had a temporary loss of balance too.

i keep hearing different directions for cleaning ears. equal parts vinegar/water is my current protocol, advice of vet. i add in a few drops of alcohol for bacterial control. does anyone have an ear cleaning maintenance protocol they recommend for dogs getting frequent ear infections? maybe i'm hurting rather than helping.

[raeandmontana]

everyone, ultasoynd and xrays done
after tests they have found out this:
she has a mass in her intestine.
they are aspirating to find out what of. if cancerous they will recommend chemo, if not they will recommend surgical removal. they r surprised no diahreeah.
also, she has a swollen adrenal gland.
I am waiting to see results of urine culture for the UTI that we treated with convenia antibiotic three weeks ago, and results of cushings urinalysis.

I am freaking out here at the vet I don't know what to think
please tell me your thoughts.

[Squirt's Mom]

Hi Rae,

Just a note to let you know you are not alone. Please let us know what the final say is and what the plan of action will be.

Our thoughts and prayers are with you both.
Hugs,
Leslie and the gang

[jmac]

Just wanted to let you know I am thinking of you and hoping for the best. I'll be waiting to hear what you found out...

Julie & Hannah

[StarDeb55]

Rae, I'm afraid that any testing done for Cushing's at the moment, with the discovery of the intestinal mass, may very well be invalid. The presence of a non-adrenal medical issue could very well raise the cortisol & give you a false positive results on the UCCR, I'm assuming that's is the test you had done.

Debboe

[frijole]

Joining the others in sending you and Montana tons of love and well wishes. Kim

[Squirt's Mom]

Mornin' sweetie,

How are things this morning? What did you learn from the aspiration yesterday?

Keeping you and Montana in my thoughts and prayers.

Hugs,
Leslie and the gang

[raeandmontana]

hello everyone and thanks for checking in. Still waiting on test results for the aspirate of the mass in her intestine, as well as the urinalysis of both cushings (Debbie i got your message that it might be invalid), and uti. meanwhile she's short on energy, weak back legs, a bit labored breath and not moving around fast at all but managing. she follows my baby and I all around for a good part of the day. we two are her most favorite people as you can see! she also is not peeing quite as much. her drinking is about 2-2.5 cups/day.

LAST NIGHT she had a seizure. lasted about 3mins. (she is epileptic, she used to have them every 4 months or so, but she hasnt had one in over 6 months.)
that was really scary i thought we'd lost her. but then she came out of it. i gave her 2mg diazepham to make sure she doesnt have another. she seemed in pain today. vet suggested i give her one dose of metacam in case it is pain, not just tiredness. So i did. i think it might have helped because after her night bath she ran around the house for a few seconds.
but then, again, at same time, while settling down to sleep she HAD ANOTHER SEIZURE. identical to last night in intensity and length (they used to be less intense as the years went by). i think i'll skip the diazepham tonight. i dont want to overdo drugs on her system. i prefer to do no drugs at all till we get results back.
i'm so worried what she has isnt treatable. if its not cushings, how do you treat a mass in the intestine? i mean really, she's 12.5yrs old. shes sick right now. she has an enlarged adrenal gland and high liver ATL (265 as of last week). maybe it's all due to this mass.
and meanwhile, she seems to be feeling slightly less energetic everyday.
i miss her. i miss her bark and her playing with her ball and chasing the vacuum. i'm keeping her from the vacuum i wonder if i should let her chase it to cheer her up but i dont want to make matters worse.
i feel like everythings out of my control. i want to fix her but i can't.

[jmac]

So sorry to hear Montan's having a rough time. It is so hard to watch them struggle and to see them act differently. Still thinking of you and hoping for the best on the test results.

Julie & Hannah

[raeandmontana]

tonight is a sleepless night. I keep thinking she's dying- she had another seizure at 9pm, then i gave her diazepam medication for it so it won't happen again. ok for an hour, then at 11:30 she was panting for an hour, wanted to walk around. the drug does that to her at times. but now she is trembling and breathing heavy and it won't stop shes trying so hard to get comfortable but only when she stands up does she stop breathing heavy. but she's trying to sleep, when lying down it's as if there is something obstructing her chest... harder for her to breathe, or maybe she feels another seizure coming.. I don't know what to do, jose is handling this better than I am, I had to leave the room. maybe it's the drugs prescribed not going well with her together, I don't know. maybe they will wear off. (told to give her metacam at 6pm for pain/inflammation, plus the diazepam for seizure at 9, then just a tiny bit of tramadol for pain, so per Tenzor instructions I'm underdosing the tramadol). I don't rust the drugs but what if it's pain not drugs and I'm underdosing. this is killing me I feel like dying.
maybe we get cti scan to see what's going on so I know.

[addy]

I have no answers for you and sweet Montana. I am so sorry this all happening and I fully understand your feelings of helplessness.

Sometimes, when things are dark and bleak and we think we have no more strength to give, we rally and find that strength.

You will find your strength through all the worry and pain and we will all be here right by your side sending love and hugs and prayers of support.

Love,
Addy

[jmac]

I'm so, so sorry to hear that things are not going well for Montana. I wish I had some helpful advice to offer. I can't imagine what you are going through, and I would be going crazy if I were you. I hope you are able to get some help from your vet to figure things out.

Thinking of you and hoping Montana is feeling a little better...

Julie & Hannah

[raeandmontana]

just a small update. montana has had no seizures since saturday night (just about exactly 5 days ago) and probably, or possibly, due to the phenobartital we put her on 11am saturday. she was at first very off balance and had ataxia, and breathed/panted hard every night. now we have reduced the dose a bit and she is doing a little better on it. though that might be due to me understanding her rythm better. she was on metacam for pain (if it was pain, which everyone beleived she looked like she was in) but it didnt seem to do much. on monday i switched to prednisilone, i did NOT want to give it to her since what IF she is cushings or heading for cushings? but the vet got the urinary test back and it wasnt too too high or probable for cushings and plus someone here mentioned if she has a tumor then it might give a false positive result. anyway, im already weaning her off it b/c it doesnt seem to help either. she is still stiff walking, ataxia in back legs (loses balance a lot), not full of energy at all and most oddly, three things:
1--she will NOT LAY DOWN without force and when she does she breathes heavy for some time, and wakes up to reposition and sometimes wont lay down again without some coaxing. the hard floor has been the best way to get her to relax. on her side. she falls asleep then we put her on the bed for rest of night. she will not sit either, only when she is so tired that her back legs give out and she doesnt have strength to get up again. btw, the harder surfaces she wants to lay on and will NOT lay on her soft dog bed anymore. why has this changed? what is causing this? i hope to god its not related to that tumor in her intestine??
2--she paces a lot, and stands a lot watching us. but wont fully rest. she is very alert and wants food all the time and drinks a lot like before, pees all the time and even all over herself when sleeping (This i am told is from the prednisolone which i am stopping now)
3--when outside peeing seems a bit more of a struggle and pooping even moreso. she pants when she poops. she avoids pooping by circling for several times. the poop is hard and very small. its always been a bit hard and small. the food i feed her is natures logic raw and i add many supplements like salmon oil, fresh parsley/cilantro, gentle digest, dmg, cranberry capsule (to prevent reinfection uti), and standard process renal support powder. i dont know how to make it looser without creating diareah-- she is very sensitive. maybe someone can suggest.
REMEMBER: an ultrasound found a small tumor in her small intestine. it is cancerous according to the aspiration but not sure what kind. dr. suggest operating soon but i dont think shes strong enough yet.

not sure what i do or where i go. should she get complete bedrest? could it be simply a pinched nerve getting worse bc of not having rest? but she seems in pain when lying down. she want to be upright when sleeping but that's impossible.

i fear its the tumor hurting her and thats why she wont lie down.
if its hip displasia (that is shown in xrays) why will it cause her to be able to get up fairly easily but NOT get down/lay down?

[frijole]

Alot of the symptoms you described could be from the prednisone - panting, peeing, pacing.... it is like cortisol... think adrenaline rush... that explains alot of the problems so glad you stopped it.

Can't answer the sitting/laying questions but probably due to pain... just not sure why.

Re poops try canned dog food vs kibble. Slippery Elm Bark is used for diarrhea AND constipation. Also good for tummy aches and ulcers. You can google and read lots on it. 1 tsp in a cup of water makes a batch. Put 2 TBS in with food. I bought mine online as I couldn't find it in our health food store but alot do carry it.

Hope this helps a bit! Kim

[raeandmontana]

Kim, thank you for the help wtih teh slippery elm idea! do you think its safe if im already using all my supplements i listed, as well as (i forgot to list) milk thistle (for her high liver enzyme)? and what if she has a tumor in her intestine, will the slippery elm do anyting to cause it to rupture, etc.? im so freaked out about that tumor!!

yes the pred is going to be out of her system by tomorrow since it takes 24 hrs. and then we are suggested to go back to metacam just b/c its safer for her. i dont know what else to do. if its a slipped disc, or back or hip or arthritis problem id think she needs medication to keep it under control so it can heal.

----advise on pain meds and anti inflammatory meds for dogs predisposed to cushings, high liver enzyme, and an enlarged adrenal gland, and a small tumor in her intestine would be greatly appreciated!!!----

again thank you Kim and all of you for your support. she has been my healer for 12 years now i hope i can help to heal her.

[labblab]

I do believe that slippery elm is generally considered to be a safe supplement for both people and dogs. I have been considering it for my dog who is having some recurrent GI issues. However, one warning that I have seen is that it should not be given at the same time as other medications because its coating action may affect the absorption of the other meds. This article discussing use in humans suggests not giving slippery elm any closer than two hours before or after other meds.

http://www.umm.edu/altmed/articles/slippery-elm-000274.htm

This has made it a little awkward for me to figure out a good timing for it, since my dog is also taking phenobarb twice daily for seizure control, and I definitely do not want to screw up the effectiveness of the phenobarb. But if you can figure out a good timing for the slippery elm, we have several folks here who highly recommend it.

Marianne

[Squirt's Mom]

I am one who uses SEB (Slippery Elm Bark) for both my babies and myself. Trink has colitis, thankfully well controlled at the moment, and I have IBS. Squirt has always had occasional upset. The SEB does wonders and it doesn't take much to work! I LOVE the smell when mixing it...it has a very earthy, clean scent. It has a slightly sweet taste so it is easy to give to the pups and easy for me to take as well. Here is a link on SEB: (scroll down to slippery elm bark)

http://www.littlebigcat.com/index.php?

Something else you might try is pumpkin - plain, unseasoned pumpkin, not the kind for pies. Pumpkin will also work on both diarrhea and constipation via fibers. Here is a pretty good link that explains pumpkin for our pets:

http://davesgarden.com/guides/articles/view/1817/

It seems logical to me that the tumor in the intestine could be pressing against other organs making it uncomfortable to lay or sit, and difficult to get up once down. It could also be causing the lungs to have less room to function, making him pant more. If your vet says Montana is ready for surgery and you have discussed it with a board certified surgeon who also says this is a viable approach, I would give it serious consideration. And sooner rather than later. Time may allow her to become stronger but it is going to let that tumor grow more, causing more and more problems for Montana. I would want to talk with the BC surgeon in depth first, tho, and know exactly what he anticipates and what he feels the prognosis would be. Your GP vet can give you some insight, but the board certified surgeon is the expert and can give you the best info so you can make the best decision for your baby. Time can work both for Montana and against her. ;)

It is good to hear that she hasn't had any seizures for several days now! I hope she doesn't have any for many more days to come.

Hugs,
Leslie and the gang

[frijole]

I don't know about the tumor on the intestine... It is said to be a soothing agent ... My dog has ulcers in her tummy and down her entire esophagus and I started it about a month ago and it does seem to help.

Marianne - thank you as I did not read the part about taking with other supplements.

[raeandmontana]

Well folks, heres the update. i have in this writeup three mysteries which i wonder if anyone has had similiar experiences and found solutions.

first off---yaaay. NO SEIZURES since saturday july 30th 11pm. they stopped maybe b/c we began the phenobarbital that same day at 11am. So she had a total of 5 seizures in 5 days. So fingers crossed that seems to be behind us for 10 days now...

I have taken montana off ALL pain meds and inflammatory meds as they didn’t seem to help her at all and she had high liver enzymes anyway. Now she is only on 1/2 dose phenobarbital and several natural supplements like milk thistel (liver), chinese herb for her intestinatal tumor and energy level (wei chi booster), ark naturals digestive enzyme, standard process renal supplement and capsule cranberry powder which I used to have her on years ago to avoid UTIs. I also added some parsley/beans/cilantro to her diet too. and accupuncture 1x/wk.

Sadly, she is still not energetic and hangs her head low, but due to the reduction in phenobartibotal she seems closer to where we were three weeks ago when i joined this post, before her seizures. Her back legs are not falling all over the place. hungry and back to drinking a normal amount of water. Her digetstive system seems to be working normally. Same weight. Good skin/fur. Not needing to bathe her as often for her once really problematic skin condition.

No playing, running, trotting, rubbing on rug, going down/up outdoor steps or chairs, no barking, sitting on floor. She did all this about two months ago. This was what brought me to you in the first place. Plus high liver enzyme and enlarged adrenal gland. Cushings? the urine was positive but could be from the tumor... plus she's not drinking/peeing that much anymore.

big mystery #1--NOW, NO LYING DOWN, unless forced. She used to lie down for a large part of the day so I know this is exhausting for her, walking and standing for so long. So I force her to lie down but she pops back up. this has been happening for two weeks, since the seizures began. And she only stays down if she's completely exhausted. If she’s not exhausted, she begins breathing deeply and loudly, lets out a sneeze/snort like she might have a little congestion in her nose, then pops up. I know she’s exhausted because she slowly circles around a spot, pauses-repeats. sometimes pants a little. So I pick her up, lay her on her side and plop her down. She looks uncomfortable at first then slowly drifts off. wakes up in about an hour or two.
Q --does anyone have any ideas what could be causing this, could it be simply pain from joints (this is a sudden thing, began after her seizures, maybe the seizures pulled her neck out), or the fear of another seizure? or a tumor making it uncomfortable to lay, or lungs not able to breathe under pressure of floor? or simple lack of energy to breathe when something is resting on her chest? But harder surfaces seem better for her now. Vet doesn't know but guesses its neck pain. but she moved her head around fine this morning when she rubbed her chin on the rug. At night she sleeps better and longer. only wakes up a few times to reposition herself. much less heavy breathing.

Q. mystery #2--after we let her out for a pee break at 3am, she sneezes and breathes loudly and trembles in her forehead for about 1 minutes while circling to lie down. does anyone have an idea what this is? is it a type of epileptic tremor? she is sensitive to the outdoors pollens and i do know that she tends to sneeze a bit after being outside but not sure what the trembling is from.

Q. mystery #3-- when she poops (3xday) she always starts panting before/during/after. always. this used to occur only when she had diarhea. could it be tumor related? or joint pain related?

GP vet saw the ultrasound pics from the specialist and says the tumor appears to be small-the size of a dime, i see it is sorta near her colon. He wants to do an ultrasound next week of it himself. And to look at the right adrenal and liver too. they were both enlarged per the pics.

same vet also wants to do another blood test to see her overall condition and if her liver enzymes are back to normal levels. they were over 280 three weeks ago.

Thanks for your help and interest.

[raeandmontana]

hello everyone. thank you for taking my questions and I'll never forget your help.

montana had another seizure friday at two, while finally trying to rest. she didn't seem to cone our if it with much energy and vet said I should give tramadol. I'm no fan of that drug for her it makes her drunk and panting. this time ithe dose (along with seizure) seemed to exacerbate her exhaustion (or maybe it wasn't drug related at all I will never know for sure.) anyway, she slept about an hour then woke up pacing and bonking into things until around 7, which time she collapsed and with tongue out of her mouth, and heavy breathing, unable to open her eyes fully or able to move much at all, she slowly died. by 3am she quit breathing so heavy and seemed to sleep. (perhaps tramadol wore off), but then another seizure. after that we felt she was more at peace. sleeping. at 5:45 am her breath stopped entirely and she died peacefully.
my soulmate is gone. my precious gem who has been by my side for 12 3/4 years is now free. from what she died of I dont know. surmise it was some sort of tumor near her head. I don't know what else it could have been exhausting her and keeping her from lying down to sleep.
everyone please be cautious of tramadol.
thank you for your time.

[BestBuddy]

I am so sorry to hear Montana is gone. She fought the good fight but sometimes the battle just can't be won. She knew you loved her and tried so hard. Try to remember the good times in her honor.

Jenny

[Jenny & Judi in MN]

I looked at her pictures on your profile. What a smile. Sounds like she lived a well loved life and I'm so very sorry she is gone.

Judi

[StarDeb55]

I am so deeply sorry for the loss of your beloved Montana. I know words don't mean much, now, but she is happy, free from her struggling little body, & is at peace.

I will tell you that a number of us in this group have had some pretty horrendous experiences when giving tramadol to our pups for whatever reason. When someone asks about using tramadol, we usually suggest that you give half the dose the vet suggested.

Debbie

[jmac]

I am so, so sorry to hear you lost Montana. I hope it brings you peace that you were with her in the end and that she went peacefully. Try to remember all of the happy memories you shared with her, and know that you were a good pet parent.

Julie & Hannah

[addy]

I am so sorry to hear of Montana. What a difficult few days and thankfully you had the strength she needed. She has been by your side for a long time and you were there at her side when she needed you most.

God speed Montana, fly free of pain now.

Please know if you need a shoulder or a hug we are here for you. Come and talk whenever you need to.

Love,
Addy

[Squirt's Mom]

Oh, honey, I am so sorry to hear that Montana has passed. I can only imagine how difficult those last few hours were but I know your presence meant so very much to Montana. From day one you stood by her side, fighting for her, loving her and when her last day came, you were still by her side, fighting and loving as only you could. When Montana left this old Earth, her spirit soared on the wings of your love.

She will always be with you, watching over you with the same love and devotion you always gave to her. Montana's suffering has ended and she is once again whole and strong, running in the Rainbow Fields with all our babies that have gone before. She knows that one day you will come and when that day comes, she will be there at the end of that Bridge waiting for you and you will never be parted again.

Our deepest sympathies,
Leslie, Squirt, Trinket, Brick and our Angels, Ruby and Crystal


A Special Gift

They're a very special gift, to be cherished and loved;
You're chosen for each other by God Himself above.
It's a match made in heaven so it can't be wrong;
You're tied together by a bond that's oh so strong.

All they'll ever ask from you is to be loved and fed,
And at night make sure they have fresh water and a bed.
In return, for so little, the rewards are so great!
You'll get a companion for life with some very special traits.

When you are lost and the end seems so far away
They'll walk by your side, they'll help you find your way.
When life gets you down they can put a smile on your face
As they run you in circles with their fast pace.

You'll share the good with the bad, you'll be happy and sad;
And through it all you have a friend, the best you ever had.
You're time together will be special and unique;
It will be as priceless to you as a rare antique.

Then, before you know it, the day will arrive
When suddenly your life takes a steep dive.
The furry friend who's been with you for all of these years
Has now passed on and left you in tears.

As you sit and wonder what did I do?
Why is this all happening to you?
Into each of our lives a little rain must fall,
And you must be strong to answer the call.

Your little one's spirit has flown home on the wings of a dove,
To a special place that awaits them in heaven above.
St. Francis will meet them; when they get home
He will take them to a meadow where they're free to roam.

There in the meadows, down by the pond,
Your furry friend will remember his loving bond.
He'll look into the water, then you appear;
He can see you're frightened, he can feel your fear
He'll look into the water, then you appear;
He can see you're frightened, he can feel your fear
Through the bond that still ties you from heaven above
He looks down upon you, he sends you his love.

Through the bond that still ties you from heaven above
He looks down upon you, he sends you his love.
Because you loved him and because you care
Whenever you need him, he'll always be there.

There, in the meadows, they patiently wait for the day
When you will celebrate your life together, each and every day.
Waiting for that day; when you come walking back home
When together for an eternity through the meadows you'll roam.

Author Unknown

[littleone1]

I am so sorry for your loss. My thoughts and prayers are with you. Rest in Peace Montana.

[Nika'sMom]

I am so sorry for your loss...please know that you are in my thoughts and prayers...RIP sweet Montana.....
hugs, Lynda and Nika

[Cyn719]

I am so sorry about Montana - she had a wonderful life and a wonderful mom and she knew that for sure!!! Remember she is with God and pain free and happy - and she would want you to remember all the happy times you had together - Love and prayers to you

xoxo Cindy & Penny

[apollo6]

I am so sorry to hear about the loss of your angel Montana. She was very loved. May she be watching over you in heaven and be at peace.
Hugs Sonja and Apollo

[mypuppy]

So saddened for the loss of your sweet baby. May her beautiful memories help sustain you during this difficult moment.

God bless you and precious Montana.

[MBK]

I know words don't help much when your pain is so deep. But, all of us here know what it is to love a dog and share your tears. I am so very sorry for your loss. Montana had a good life with you and like others have said, you were there when she needed you most.

Rest in peace, sweet Montana.

[k9diabetes]

I am very sorry to learn of Montana's passing.

I think your guess about what happened as far as perhaps having a tumor in the brain somewhere makes sense. Agitation and disorientation, along with seizures, can often occur when a brain tumor is involved.

Godspeed to Montana,

Natalie

[bgdavis]

I'm very sorry for your loss of Montana. You both fought the good fight, but there are things way beyond our control. Rest in peace, Montana.

Bonnie and Angel Criss

[jrepac]

Rest easy Montana.

Jeff, Angel Mandy, Pebbles & Pepper

[Casey's Mom]

I am so sorry to hear of your loss of Montana. You went through so much with her, it breaks my heart. RIP dear Montana and peace to your mom who tried so hard to help you.

Love and many hugs,

[Leena]

So so sorry for your loss....Hugs to you at this very difficult time...