New to K9 Cushings (Kooter Brown, Diabetic 7 yr old Pom)

[KellyB]

Hello All: I have just registered and this is my first post. My dog is a seven year old Pom and his name is Kooter Brown. He is such a special dog. He has not be diagnosed yet with Cushings as we are waiting on more test results but the specialist (not Kooter's regular Vet) says it is looking more and more likely.

Right now I am awaiting the results from the Urine Cortisol Creatinine Ratio and Urine Culture taken yesterday. I have very limited knowledge of the Cushings but if I am not mistaken, this is the test that can rule OUT the disease correct?

Thing is there are many other concerns pointing to Cushings. He is diabetic and we cannot get him regulated on the insulin. He has been on prescription food and insulin shots (2x daily) for five months. His glucose still runs around 400. He has lost seven pounds in those five months but he is constantly begging me for food. He has been having seizures for about 3 years now. All testing to resolve that came to a dead end. He started drinking like crazy. He urinates in the house which is totally not like him. He would rather die than wet the floor. He is having problems jumping up on the couch. He seeks out cooler surfaces to rest on. His behavior has changed. He pants alot. His breath is terrible. He is lazy beyond belief. He has no skin issues that I am aware of but he is really furry. His belly is somewhat bigger even though he has lost weight. But I would not call it a pot belly.

He had an ultrasound yesterday and all looked good. That ruled out other diseases as possibilities but did not rule out Cushings. His blood work showed elevated platelet count, elevated alkaline phosphatase, elevated amylase and lipase. I have no idea what all that means other than it all points to Cushings is how I understood it. Yesterday I spent $1K for very little information. Since March I have spent nearly the same. I am wondering how much the treatment is going to run if he does indeed have Cushings? I am also wondering how long I can expect him to live? He is only seven. It is all very discouraging. First he started with seizures, next was an operation to save his life due to him eating panty hose, next the diabetes and now possible Cushings. I'm gonna call the clinic now and see if those results are in. Thank you for any comments. Sorry for the rambling. I'm so upset. He is my best friend.

[Squirt's Mom]

Hi and welcome to you and Kooter Brown! :)

You can both relax a bit now because you have found the very best place to learn about Cushing's from folks who live with it daily. The experience and first-hand knowledge you will find here is astounding and the support is incomparable.

We will play 20 Questions with you for a bit but is just so we can get a better picture of what is going on with Kooter and be able to offer more meaningful feedback. So to kick things off:

Are you a member of our sister site, K9Diabetes? If not, check them out - http://www.k9diabetes.com/forum/. They are the experts on canine diabetes and I know you will benefit from their experiences, too. What kind and how much insulin is Kooter getting now?

Is he on any other meds, supplements, herbs, ect. and if so what and how much?

Do you have copies of the actual test results he has had so far? If not your vet should be glad to provide them to you. If you could post the results of any blood work, just the values that are high or low, and then the results of the ACTH when you get it, that would help us a great deal. Most of us keep a copy of testing at home in a file just in case we ever have to see a different vet for any reason.

One thing I want to mention is a form of Cushing's called Atypical. Kooter is a Pom, a Nordic breed, and the Nordic breeds seem to be prone to this form of Cushing's. Atypical does not involve cortisol but rather some or all of five intermediate, or sex, hormones. If the ACTH comes back normal, this is an area you will want to look into.

I am glad you found us and hope to learn more about you and Kooter in the future.

Hang in there! You and Kooter are not alone any longer. We will be with you every step of the way.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always

[jrepac]

Hello there....

yes, it sounds/looks like Cushings based on what you described. It is possible for the ultrasound to be normal and cushings present (mine was like that). But, wait and see what the UCCR test says...it could rule out Cushings, you never know. Honestly, the cost of the testing is worse than the cost of the treatment...I also went round and round with tests over and 18 month period...but once you get the diagnosis, the treatment costs are not horrible (but will depend on what you choose/what your vet recommends).

It is treatable, just take it one day at a time.

Good luck!

Jeff

[KellyB]

Thanks so much for your thoughts.

I will check out K9Diabetes as I have never been pointed in that direction. He is on Humulin N and gets 6 units twice a day. He eats only prescription Hills w/d dog food and treats. He is on no other medication.

The test results I have here at the house do not give actual "numbers" but only use words like "elevated". I will be asking for those actual readings.

If they have ruled out liver disease, kidney disease and pancreatitis what else could it be other than the Cushings?

[apollo6]

First Welcome, you and Kooter Brown.
If you had an ultrasound , the vet should be looking for one or both adrenal glands to be enlarged, also enlarged liver. Hang in there,
like the other's said first find out which cushing it is-there are three kinds, only then do you decide on which treatment to use. Find a vet who is knowledgeable about cushions. It took me almost a year until I finally came up with the diagnose. Read all you can, ask questions. You don't have to make a decision right away. We are here to help.
Sonja and Apollo.

[Harley PoMMom]

Hi and welcome to you and Kooter Brown from me and my boy Harley! I am so sorry for the circumstances that brought you here but glad you found this forum and we will help you in any way we can.

The Urine Cortisol Creatinine Ratio test can rule out Cushing's but one has to realize the reason this test is preferred first, sometimes, is because it is the least stressful on the pup, however, any non-adrenal illness can create a false positive on any Cushing's test. With Kooter Brown having unregulated diabetes, I am not sure how realiable the UC:CR test will be.

Is Kooter Brown taking any seizure medication?


elevated alkaline phosphatase, elevated amylase and lipase. I have no idea what all that means
Alkaline phosphatase is a liver enzyme which means the liver is working harder, alot of our cush-pups have elevated ALP; elevated amylase and lipase are usually pancreas enzymes but other things can cause these levels to be elevated.

Cushing's is a slow progressing disease so one does have the time to get a proper diagnosis for their pup. A proper diagnosis is vital to a proper treatment plan.

As Leslie mentioned in her post I, too, strongly urge you to join our sister site K9Diabetes. They will help you immensely with Kooter Brown and his diabetes.

Remember you are not alone we are here for you and Kooter Brown, so ask all the questions you want and we will answer them the best we can, ok!

Love and hugs,
Lori

Here are some links to help you understand Cushing's:

Links to Cushings Websites (especially helpful for new members!) http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/showthread.php?t=180

How to Interpret Tests for Canine Hyperadrenocorticism (Herrtage, Mooney, Bruyette)
http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/showthread.php?t=227

Helpful Resources for Owners of Cushing's Dogs
http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=10

[k9diabetes]

Hi!

I'm the admin at k9diabetes.com. Just wanted to welcome you here and there.

Sometimes vets are shy about increasing the insulin dose... how much does Kooter Brown weigh?

I'm not concerned about an insulin dose being too large until it's approaching 1 unit per pound and still no improvement in blood sugar. I have seen a couple of terriers who needed 21 units for a 25 pound dog but they were well regulated - they just need more insulin than the average dog.

Do you have a copy of the last curve done that you could post?

Natalie

[KellyB]

Surprise surprise the Specialist called me on a Saturday with the results of the Urine Cortisol Creatinine Ratio test. That was really unexpected and nice of her. It was positive. We are still waiting for the results of the urine test. I don't recall the name of the test but it is not your basic urine test. I am moving forward with the Low Dose Dexamethasone Suppression Test next week. If that is positive, I guess we will be sending blood work to Tennessee for the panel test they offer there. Thing is, we have ruled out nearly everything except Cushings. The Doc has not diagnosed him with C yet but has said she does expect to do so after a few more tests. I guess this is all not sounding too good?

[Squirt's Mom]

Hi Kelly,


I guess this is all not sounding too good?

Well, that kinda depends on how you look at it. ;) It sounds like your vet is on the right diagnostic path and that is a BIG plus as we have seen many vets rush into treatment with disastrous results. You have ruled out diabetes and hypothyroidism - another BIG plus as one endocrine problem at a time is plenty! And you have us now! :D

Just remember that Cushing's is a very slowly progressing condition and you have plenty of time to make sure what you are dealing with. So until all the tests results are in, just enjoy Kooter as you always have. Even if it does turn out that he has Cushing's, you will both be fine. Cushing's isn't the end of the world as I felt it was at first and it can be managed.

In your spare time, learn all you can about Cushing's. We are here to help you with that so ask any questions you have. The more you know the easier this will be for both of you.

Keep your chin up!
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always