Boomer, 12 y/o Golden on Trilostane - Boomer has crossed The Bridge

[amelia]

Hi Everyone
Is there any relationship between Cushings & Seizures?I have a 11yr old Golden that was diagnosed with Cushing in April 09. He is on 50mg of Trilostane once a day. He had (2) seizures last May - 4 days apart. We had just put him on Trilostane & then stopped it to adjust the dose so I thought the seizure was due to stopping the Trilostane. He had no other seizures until today. He is not on any seizure meds. It is so scary when this happens. Has anyone else experienced this? If so, any suggestions on what to do?
We have a vet appt tomorrow because I felt 3 lumps on his neck, the size of a jawbreaker. I don't know what to worry about first.

[Franklin'sMum]

Hi
Can you describe the seizure?
________
Lincoln continental mark v history (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Lincoln_Continental_Mark_V)

[labblab]

Amelia, I've taken the liberty of moving this new thread to the "Questions and Discussion" forum so that you'll be able to talk more about your 11 y/o golden here. I know you already have a thread started in which we are discussing Cushing's diagnostics for your younger golden, Comet. But this way, you can also have a discussion thread going for your older baby. Gosh, it sounds like you have an awful lot on your plate right now!!! :o

Marianne

[amelia]

We were walking down the stops & I turned around & he came tumbling down. I expect that the seizure started on the steps, which is why he fell down. He lay at the bottom of the steps, very tense, shaking, urinated on himself, drooling/foaming at the mouth, eyes glassy. His eyes were open the entire time & he was awake. When it stopped he had a hard time getting up & keep falling. He had no strength in his back legs & 1 of his front. He kept pacing & circling & falling & knocking into things. When he was on the ground his legs were NOT thrashing about & I guess it was because he was against the doorway & wall & didn't have much room so he was kinda crunched up. His seizures last year -he was kicking but not this time.
One thing he did today but not the last times was barking at me continually. He was like he was afraid of me because he was backing away from me. He continued to pace & circle for about an 1 1/2 hrs. Little by little his rear legs are looking better. After about 3 hours, I walked him outside & he was much better & has been sleeping for acouple of hours now.
I gave him some drops of Bach's flower remedy. It is suppose to relax the dogs & help with seizures or when they are stressed. He seems good now. But of course, I don't know when or if he will have another one.

I was wondering if it is due to the tumor in his brain since he has PDH. Could it be getting bigger or maybe not related.

[lulusmom]

Most dogs with cushing's have a a small lesion on the pituitary called a microadenoma. These are highly unlikely to cause seizures unless the tumor grows and becomes a much bigger tumor known as a macroadenoma. With Boomers seizures starting over a year ago, you would have seen some serious neurological signs long ago. It's not always easy for a vet to determine the cause and it's usually by process of elimination. Most vets will not prescribe medication until the dog is having frequent seizures.

My little Pomeranian has had at least two random seizures, the last one being several months ago. I'm just keeping my fingers crossed that she never has another one. Here's a link to some very good information on seizures.

http://www.canine-epilepsy.com/Resources.html

P.S. I did find that Goldens are a breed that seem to be over represented when it comes to seizures
http://www.grrinews.org/fall02seizures.htm

[labblab]

I have only one quick moment to post, so don't have time to "credit" this quote properly. But it comes from a link on our "Important Information" forum that I will give below.


Seizures, while often associated with other intracranial
neoplasms, are an uncommon manifestation of PMAs [Pituitary Macroadenomas].

It is only natural to wonder whether other illnesses that our Cushpups exhibit are somehow related to the Cushing's. But apparently seizures are more likely caused by something other than enlarging pituitary tumors.

Here's a link to three articles related to pituitary macrotumors (the quote above came from the first article of the three):

http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/showthread.php?t=229

Marianne

P.S. I see that Glynda and I were posting at the same time...

[StarDeb55]

Amelia, I know the seizures are extremely scary, & I certainly don't want to add to your anxiety. IMO, the lumps you found on Boomer's jaw are the priority. My 1st boy, Barkley, developed lymphoma at 13. In the process of his chemo, I learned from his oncologist that the highest percentage of dogs that they treat for lymphoma are goldens. You not only need to get him to his IMS ASAP, please get one of those lumps aspirated, & a referral in place for an oncologist. Lymphoma is very aggressive, but it definitely can be treated, if this happens to be the problem. Please keep us posted as I have been down this road, & can help.

Debbie

[Franklin'sMum]

He lay at the bottom of the steps, very tense, shaking, urinated on himself, drooling/foaming at the mouth, eyes glassy. His eyes were open the entire time & he was awake. When it stopped he had a hard time getting up & keep falling. He had no strength in his back legs & 1 of his front. When Franklin first started behaving oddly, I asked a friend who had an epileptic pup to describe what Elly did during her seizures. Pretty much exactly as you wrote.

He kept pacing & circling & falling & knocking into things. Franklin is now up to five of these episodes that I have seen. He paces, circles, tries to sit, circles again, and has staggered both forwards and backwards, and twice fallen on his tush. When it's over, he usually pants for 10-20 mins than falls asleep.

When he was on the ground his legs were NOT thrashing about & I guess it was because he was against the doorway & wall & didn't have much room so he was kinda crunched up. His seizures last year -he was kicking but not this time. If it is a seizure, caused by epilepsy or something else, it's a muscle spasm, and he has no control over if he kicks or thrashes about a little or a lot.

One thing he did today but not the last times was barking at me continually. Maybe it's kinda like people who suffer migraines, how some can feel when one is coming on. maybe his barking at you was like "Mum, something's happening, I need you". With Franklin's first 3 eps, he rubbed against my legs, like a cat does, but harder, was panting, clingy and anxious. When I picked him up, he would cling on real tight, and gouged and clawed me.:eek:

He was like he was afraid of me because he was backing away from me.:( Oh sweetie, you're his person, I'm sure he wasn't afraid of you.
Little by little his rear legs are looking better. After about 3 hours, I walked him outside & he was much better & has been sleeping for acouple of hours now.


I was wondering if it is due to the tumor in his brain since he has PDH. Could it be getting bigger or maybe not related.[/QUOTE]
My question, too, and I don't know the answer. Please keep us updated,
Jane, Franklin and Bailey xxx
________
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[judymaggie]

Amelia -- the only thing I can do to help you is share my experiences with Maggie. During the last year of her life she started having seizures. We already knew that she had severely compromised liver function when they started. Her vet explained to me that, because her liver was not functioning well, ammonia was starting to build up in her body and one of the areas that it builds up in is the brain, thus causing her seizures.

The first time that Maggie had a seizure I actually I thought she was having a heart attack -- we were outside and she just keeled over, all her limbs rigid. After about a minute, she came to, tried to get up and couldn't. I carried her into the house where she recovered after a short while. Her next seizures were more like you described -- before every seizure she would scream. Not bark, actually scream -- then fall over, thrash, foam at the mouth and usually urinate. As Maggie got sicker, she had cluster seizures -- the first time she had ten short seizures, about a minute apart.

I learned a lot about seizures really quickly -- this website helped me immensely: http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/default.htm

If it makes you feel any better, I always thought the seizures were much more scary for me than for Maggie. Like Franklin, Maggie would always sleep very heavily after having a seizure while my heart continued to pound. Hang in there!

[littleone1]

Hi Amelia,

I haven't posted to you before. Corky and I would like to welcome you and Boomer.

Corky started to have seizures about 4 years before he showed any clincical signs of cushings. The first time he had one, I was getting ready for work and I heard loud thuds. He was thrashing around in the hallway and bumping into the walls. His vet at that time didn't know what was causing them. I kept a log recording the dates on which they happened and how long they lasted. As time went by, they tapered off, and weren't as bad, and finally stopped. The last seizure Corky had was last February, but it was due to medication he was taking. It was also a different kind of seizure than the others.

I hope that you will be able to get an answer to what is happening to Boomer.

Terri

[Nathalie]

Hello Amelia,

Like your Avatar :)

I just wondering if you had a full thyroid panel done? Since so many dogs with Cushings also are hypothyroid and seizures are very commen in dogs with untreated hypothyroidism it could be something to look into.

I had a little Rat Terrier foster dog once with seizures - very scary if you are not 'used' to it.
Nathalie

[amelia]

Hi Terri
I think you diagnosed him. We saw our IMS today, he is pretty sure Boomer has lymphoma. He has lumps in all his lymph nodes. He aspirated acouple, took blood & tomorrow we ultrasound & see the oncologist. This poor boy has been through so much, I'm not sure what Iwant to do. But I know I couldn't bear to see him suffer. We will see what all the test results say & decide from there. I feel like my heart is ripping out of my chest. Does anyone have experience with chemo & how do the dogs tolerate it?

[frijole]

Hi! I am so sorry to hear the news but Debbie who is a member here has experience with chemo and I am sure she will help you. Hang in there and know we will pray for you and dear Boomer. Hugs, Kim

[littleone1]

Hi Amelia,

I understand what you're going through. I know that just over a year ago, I was beside myself, as I wasn't sure about Corky. I know that we all make the right decisions for our furbabies.

My thoughts and prayers are with you and Boomer.

[StarDeb55]

Actually Amelia, I'm the one who told you to get Boomer to his IMS as I had an extremely strong suspicion this was lymphoma. I'm very sorry that this turned out to be the case. Now, I will tell you the good news, & to do that I will have to tell you Barkley's story.

My 1st cushpup, Barkley, was diagnosed with lymphoma at 13 after being treated for Cushing's for about 6 years. Barkley, too, had been through so much besides his cushing's, including severe allergies with repeated ear infections, 2 surgeries to repair a blown cruciate ligament in one knee, just to name a few. When his IMS made the diagnosis, my inital thought was that at his age I did not want to put him through anything else. I did know that I at least wanted to talk to an oncologist to see what the options were so I could make the best informed decision that I could. I don't think much has changed when it comes to treatment options, but the oncologist will go over everything with you. First of all, lymphoma is extremely aggressive, 6-8 weeks without treatment. When I heard this, I did freak out. The other thing is that lymphoma is not curable, no matter what treatment you choose the pup will eventually relapse. There are subsequent treatments that can be used, but each remission will usually last only 1/2 the time of the previous remission. The treatment options that were presented for B were simply prednisone which would probably by him about 2-3 months, but the problem with pred only is that once the relapse occurs, no other chemo can be used. There is a major chemo protocol that I believe alternates between 4 or so different medications including pred, cytoxan, doxyrubicin, & I don't remember the others. The protocol lasts for about 1 year, & it is horribly expensive. If B had been younger, I probably would have found the $$ somehow. I don't remember what the average remission rates are using this protocol. B did the 2nd best protocol which is 5 rounds of doxyrubicin which is administered about every 2-3 week by IV infusion. Whether or not the pup gets his treatment on a specific week will also depend on what his WBC count looks like prior to treatment. If the count is too low, there will be no chemo as chemo depresses WBC's which already predisposes a pup to infection, so you don't want the WBCs dropping any lower. B did not developed any infection during treament, but he had to go on antibiotics once, simply as a precaution because his count was just a tad low.

When it comes to the rest of the diagnostics, B's IMS simply aspirated one mass that was easy to stick a needle in, an the abdominal ultrasound. B had multiple enlarged lymph nodes on physical exam. His US showed multiple enlarged nodes in his belly, including around his liver & spleen. The only thing I am concerned about with Boomer is the seizure. Did the IMS indicate that the seizure may have been triggered by lymphoma spread to his central nervous system? This is something to ask the oncologist.

When I quote you average remission times, please remember that an oncologist is going to give you %'s based on the treatment histories they have seen in their practice experience, some dogs do better, some do not do as well. When B was treated with the dox, the average remission time I was given was 6-8 months. B was one of his oncologist's huge success stories as his remission lasted 16 months with an excellent quality of life. I had serious doubts about treating as I'm a medical lab technologist who works in hematology, & I know what chemo does to people. I was repeatedly assured by B's oncologist that dogs do not respond like humans, chemo actually improves their quality of life. I'm looking at her like, "yeah, right! Do you forget what I do for a living?" She was right. I had a very sick boy who was literally dying day by day in front of me. About 10 days after his first round of chemo, I got home one afternoon from work, B came out immediately to meet me. I was ecstatic. I knew I had my boy back. It was literally like his fairy godmother waved her magic wand & said "You will feel better!"

B did lose his first remission at 16 months. We tried 2 other chemo protocols which gave another 4 months total. I will be up front, & say that the last month he was with me got kind of bad as I knew he was slipping away. His oncologist always told me that he would tell me when it was time because I had told her that my worst fear was that I would hold on to him for too long for my selfish reasons rather than do the last loving thing that I could for him. She was right, he told me loud & clear when I got home one afternoon, & there was no mistake on my part that he was very tired of being sick & everything that went with it. I would not trade the extra 20 months that chemo gave me for anything in the world. B was my "heart dog", & I was not ready to lose him.

The last thing I can tell you is that the cost of doxyrubicin treatment is based on the weight of the dog. B weighed 18-20 lbs, & his average costs for a single round of chemo was about $275. The timeframe for all of this was about 5-6 years ago, so I'm sure costs have gone up.

I know you are in a state of shock, & your head feels like it's going to explode one second, or you going to break down in tears the next second. All I could think of with B was, "Dear God, what else can happen to this poor creature of yours? I know you sent him to me for purpose, & I will do my best to take care of him, but please help me to make the best decisions I can for him." Unfortunately, you don't have a lot of time to learn about lymphoma. This is going to have to be the biggest crash course you have ever had. Please do not be afraid to ask questions of the oncologist. If you don't understand something, ask them to explain it, again. B's oncologist was very good. She sent me home with a huge packet of printed information explaining everything, including treatment options, & told me do not hesitate to call if I had any questions.

I'm going to PM you my e-mail, so if you need to talk further, ask questions, whatever you need, please do not be afraid to use it. I'm off right now because of illness, but when I'm at work, I won't be able to respond until the evening.

Here is a link to B's story which is posted in the "In Loving Memory" section of the forum. It goes over a lot of what I have already told you here.

http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/showthread.php?t=345

Please keep us posted.

Debbie

PS-There is one thing I need to add about the dox protocol. A pup is strictly limited to 5 cycles of this medication as the medication can be very hard on their heart muscle. In some dogs with a possible heart problem, a vet cardiologist may have to clear them to begin treatment. B did not have an heart issues, so that was no problem for him.

[lulusmom]

Awesome response, Debbie. Thank you so much for the education.

[StarDeb55]

Amelia, I forgot that there is another member, bkdice, who treated her cushpup, Niko, also for lymphoma. I have e-mailed her & asked her to post on Boomer's thread with her experiences. She should have some current information for an on-line support group, lymphoma heartdogs, which you might want to take a look at. I was active in the group when B was undergoing treatment, & found everyone to be very helpful.

Debbie

[bkdice]

Hi Amelia! I am so sorry to read that your baby has lymphoma. I know the devastation you feel getting that diagnosis. My boy was dxed with lymphoma just before he turned 16. I thought I could not do treatment.... it would be 'too hard'. Luckily I had Debbie to share her story. My boy had too much life left in him to just do nothing.

We went the same route as Debbie - single agent protocol - doxorubicin. It's the 'big gun' when fighting lymphoma. Niko had a few days under the weather, but most of his 9 months after dx were really good quality days. I am so thankful for the extra time we got.

Like people, ever dog is different and will respond differently to lymphoma. Many do quite well on chemo. The key is to know your baby and know when enough is enough. Making the decision to fight cancer is a tough one, but one that must be made with love. Some dogs go into remission easily, stay in remission, and have no side effects. Others do not tolerate it as well - which is why it's important to discuss the options, your goals, side effects, and your limits, with your oncologist. Reducing dosage amounts and / or substituting other drugs can help if he doesn't do well on one drug.

I also suggest you add a holistic vet to your regimen, if you don't have one already. Acupuncture kept Niko feeling good, and our holistic vet helped us with various herbs and supplements for the entire course.

I know how scared you are right now and I'm sorry. Please keep hope alive and explore the options. If you chose to treat, I STRONGLY urge you to join LymphomaHeartDogs. I'm still on there, as are many wonderful, supportive people. I could not have gotten through chemo w/o them. http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/LymphomaHeartDogs/

I posted about my experience with Lymphoma online, if you want to read it. There are some useful links as well. http://rememberingniko.wordpress.com/cancer/

Please feel free to email me privately ANYTIME - skyhighb@gmail.com
Hang in there! Big hugs to you....

Bettina

[labblab]

Amelia, I'm so sorry to learn of Boomer's diagnosis, but so grateful that you have Debbie and Bettina to support and guide you through possible treatment options. What a godsend to have them onboard!

Here's a question of my own for you two ladies. What might happen re: the Cushing's treatment in the event that Amelia opts for chemotherapy? Debbie, I see that prednisone is one of the chemo options that you listed. So I am wondering whether there is utility in allowing the dog's natural cortisone to increase in conjunction with the chemo? Or do you just keep things "status quo" as far as the Cushing's?

Marianne

[bkdice]

Marianne,

Pred is part of most chemo routines - however - it's not an option for a cush pup (as we know).This scared me at first, but then I realized we didn't really need it to continue with treatment. It would be good to find an oncologist that has some knowledge about cushings, or have them work with your IM vet.

Debbie and I had the same oncologist (she had moved to VA a few years ago from AZ).

I worked with my IM vet to monitor Niko's cortisol levels. We backed off the lysodren, just a hair. We wanted his numbers to err on the high side (though still 'safe') rather than the low side.

We opted for single agent protocol, because I felt that would be easiest on Niko at his age. Only had to go to the onco once every 3 weeks, so it was low stress. There are other chemo drugs out there that he could have had too. You can still do multi protocol w/o pred. It's just a matter of careful monitoring by parents, IM vet, and oncologist.

When Niko came out of remission in July, we just stopped all cush meds to let the natural cortisol rise to keep him comfortable.

I'm happy to help anywhere I can. I have to say that learning about lymphoma and treatments was very overwhelming at first - like cushings can be. But there is hope, there are options, and while it's emotionally draining, it can buy your pup some great extra time. There are dogs on the lymphomaheartdogs group that have had 2, 3, 4+ year remissions with excellent quality of life.

The key thing to remember is that we are doing this for them, and not for us, so we all must know when to back off. This can be hard when you are in the fight. It's good to lay some ground rules for yourself, and to always remember to ask yourself if you are extending life or prolonging death. I know how hard it can be to enter this fight with a mature pup, but age is not a disease. My husband said it best when we started chemo, he told me that if Niko could choose, he would choose to live.

On the flip side, chemo is expensive, and I know not everyone can do it. If one chooses not to treat, I would suggest getting together with a holistic vet to plan a route for the ultimate comfort. My sister didn't treat her doberman (this was about 5 years ago) and she had 6 months with him after dx (stats are 4-6 weeks). You just never know what you'll get.

[StarDeb55]

Marianne, for Barkley, his Cushing's treatment continued as is, no changes. His IMS took over that part of his treatment, & we both viewed from a point of quality of life to maintain the status quo. We always kept this stim within the 1-5 range. When it was explained to me, prednisone was an option for a cushpup but the biggest drawback was the very short remission time, along with the bigger problem that pred basically made the pup immune to any further treatment at the time of relapse. Nothing was ever said to me that a natural rise in cortisol would be an effective treatment, so I can't comment on that part of your question. The only problem I had was B & I were running back & forth between the GP & derm vet for 2 weeks trying to figure out what was going on. We started with the derm vet because he had made a change in some of B's medication for his allergies, B developed severe inappetance which was a huge red flag, & the race was on. I would hear one thing from one vet & something different from the other vet. Finally, the derm vet sent us to the IMS at the speciality clinic, & she had the diagnosis nailed pretty much when she examined him. Where I got upset more than anything was when I heard 6-8 weeks with no treatment, & we had spent 2 weeks dithering around already.


The key thing to remember is that we are doing this for them, and not for us, so we all must know when to back off. This can be hard when you are in the fight. It's good to lay some ground rules for yourself, and to always remember to ask yourself if you are extending life or prolonging death. I know how hard it can be to enter this fight with a mature pup, but age is not a disease. My husband said it best when we started chemo, he told me that if Niko could choose, he would choose to live.

I can't improve upon what Bettina said above. It reflects upon my feelings when Barkley got sick perfectly.

[labblab]

Bettina and Debbie, thanks very much for this additional info. And once again, what a huge gift that you two are here to help out! Amelia, I have to believe it was divine intervention that first brought you to our family on Comet's behalf -- because Boomer will surely benefit so much, too...:o

Tons of hugs to you, Amelia, as you sort out your pathway. This must be so difficult, having both boys in need of help right now. Please don't forget that we are all here to help YOU!!

Marianne

[amelia]

Hi Everyone!
Thank you soooo much for all your replies. It really is very helpful. The aspirates came back lymphoma-lymph nodes only-no organs. No other type tumors anywhere & lungs are clear.

He had another seizure at the vets prior to ultrasound. The vet is not sure if the seizure is from the lymphoma possibly spread to his head. But then again, he had a seizure 10 months ago, around the time he was diagnosed with Cushings & didn't have lymphoma then. I think the seizure is from the Cushings & the pituitary tumor may be getting bigger.

I noticed he has been very wobbly since the seizure & his back legs are very weak. He also paces ALOT. So now I am concerned if the Cushings is getting worse, what's the point of the chemo.....unless it helps with the pituitary tumor as well. Also, his appetite is good somedays & somedays not. It is weird, it looks like he is going through the motions of eating but no or little food goes in his mouth. I just gave him a piece of chicken & he opened his mouth to eat it & actually missed it & it fell. Also, sometimes he looks like he is another world or he's thinking what should I do? I think this pituitary tumor is creating havoc. Has anyone experienced these symptoms? I am waiting for the IMS to call me back so we can discuss this before chemo.

We are supposed to start chemo today but I remain concerned about Cushing. I just cannot sit back & do nothing especially when they tell me survival of 4-6 weeks. We are getting the Wisconsin protocol: vincristine, cytoxan, L-asparaginase & doxorubicin but no predisone & continuing with the Trilostane.

I am very nervous about this & will stop if he gets too sick. The vets make it sound so cut & dry & recite text book stats. So I can't go by what they say since all dogs are different.

I am concerned about drug interactions with Trilostane. I could not find anything about that & spoke w/Dechra Pharm & my IMS & they state it should be ok. I hope so! I'm wondering since his immune system is already compromised from the cushings, how the chemo will effect that.

My regular vet is conventional & holistic & she did suggest acupuncture. We have so many things going on right now, not sure where to start.

[StarDeb55]

Amelia, the oncologist will be monitoring the status of Boomer's immune system very closely. He will probably be having a complete blood count prior to every chemo session to check his white blood cell count to make sure they are high enough to tolerate the chemo. If they are not, there will be no chemo. If it's borderline, he will be put on antibiotics as a safety measure.

There is something else I forgot the other night. My oncologist told me that Barkley was not to have any more vaccinations EVER, including rabies. She said that giving vaccinations to a dog undergoing chemo with seriously compromised immune system was a recipe for certain disaster. She also said she would write me the require paperwork requesting a medical waiver for the rabies vaccine that is require by law in the state of Arizona. It would be a good idea to check into this.

The neuro symptoms are extremely concerning. Have you possibly considered a CT scan to check the status of the pit tumor? It wouldn't be quite as accurate as an MRI but I'm certain it would tell you enough to let you know if you are dealing with a macroadenoma. If it is a macroadenoma, the only treatment we are aware of is radiation. I would have a serious doubt about the proposed chemo for the lymphoma having much of an effect, if the malignancy has spread to Boomer's nervous system. This is due to the medication/chemo having to cross what is called the "blood/brain barrier." Not all medication will automatically get into the nervous system as the barrier is pretty impenetrable which is to protect the brain. There are even instances where medication for certain disease might even have to be injected directly into the nervous system to bypass this barrier. This is not just in our pups, but in all mammals.

I won't argue the fact that you & Boomer have a very long, tough road ahead of you with the Wisonconsin protocol. It does give better average remissions than the single agent protocol that Bettina & I described to you. Last but not least, Boomer's oncologist should teach you how to do lymph node checks on Boomer. There are specific areas where the lymph nodes are close to the skin, & will be easy to feel. Regular lymph node checks on your part will be the best line of defense that Boomer has to catch a relapse as early as possible.

Best of Luck to both of you! Please keep us posted & don't forget you can contact by e-mail whenever you need something.

Debbie

One other thing, if Boomer has side effects such as nausea, there are meds that can control thats & keep him comfortable. As Bettina said, you have to weigh the benefits over any & all side effects, each & every day now.

[Franklin'sMum]

Hi Amelia,
I just want to let you know that you and Boomer are in my thoughts and I'm praying for a positive outcome. Please keep us updated.
(And thanks also to Debbie and Bettina for chemo information.)
Jane, Franklin and Bailey xxx
________
California Medical Marijuana (http://california.dispensaries.org/)

[labblab]

Also, his appetite is good somedays & somedays not. It is weird, it looks like he is going through the motions of eating but no or little food goes in his mouth. I just gave him a piece of chicken & he opened his mouth to eat it & actually missed it & it fell. Also, sometimes he looks like he is another world or he's thinking what should I do? I think this pituitary tumor is creating havoc. Has anyone experienced these symptoms? I am waiting for the IMS to call me back so we can discuss this before chemo.

Amelia, I did a double-take when I read your description of Boomer trying to eat -- because it duplicates what we saw in our Cushpup (a 9-year-old Lab) at the time we assume his pituitary tumor was also enlarging. He had been treated successfully with trilostane for several months, but developed several abnormalities that pointed to a macrotumor: loss of appetite, "vacant" looks, stumbling, pacing, etc. We were pushed to a crisis stage when he stopped both drinking and eating entirely. But it wasn't just that he stopped drinking -- occasionally he would go to his water bowl, lower his head a little bit but not enough to touch the water, and then make lapping motions with his tongue -- but just lapping at the air. :( :( If was awful to watch, and hard to describe to anyone who hasn't seen a similar thing.

Our IMS could not find any other cause for his symptoms, and strongly suspected a macrotumor. But for a variety of reasons, we chose not to hospitalize him in order to have a CT or MRI done. We had already decided that we would not pursue radiation even if he did have a macrotumor. So instead, we kept him at home and loved on him until it was time to say good-by.

Apparently seizures are not a common symptom of a macrotumor. But I guess it would all depend upon the manner in which the tumor was expanding. Or maybe the seizures are related to the lymphoma. And who knows, maybe they are resulting from some sort of metabolic disturbance with Boomer. The poor boy has so much going on!

I know that time is of the essence for you in terms of the lymphoma treatment. But I think it does make sense to take at least a day or two to talk further with your IMS and to think through the ramifications of the different disease possibilities. I know you never, EVER want to give up on helping your baby if help is possible. But the hard truth is that these various procedures are quite costly -- imaging of the head, chemo, etc. And what with Comet needing help, too...before proceeding, I would want you to have a reasonable expectation that Boomer's quality of life, given all that he has going on, would truly be enhanced by the treatment/s.

Marianne

[amelia]

Hi Natalie
Funny you should mention thyroid. When all this started last year (re:Cushings). We did have a thyroid panel done & it was sent to Jean Dobbs. The results I thought were in range according to the lab but Dr. Dobbs said it was alittle low for his breed & age. We started him on thyroid meds, he was on the meds for a few months. Then the testing starting for Cushings, Lyme Disease. He was initially diagnosed as lyme positive by my vet. He transferred his care to Univ of Penn because my vet was puzzled as to what was the problem. Really all this started with his annual blood work that was all good except high protein in this urine. Anyway, when he was finally diagnosed at Penn with Cushings, he was taken off the thyroid meds because they said the Cushings could be make his numbers low. He was retested a few months later, but they only tested his T4 at that time which was 2.84, it was 1.48 -6months earlier (normal range 1.0-4.0).
Anyway, it doesn't mean that something can't be going on now but he doesn't have the symtoms specific to thyroid problems other the the ones that are also the same for Cushings....so it is hard to tell. What's another test at this point. I will mention it today.

[amelia]

But it wasn't just that he stopped drinking -- occasionally he would go to his water bowl, lower his head a little bit but not enough to touch the water, and then make lapping motions with his tongue -- but just lapping at the air. :( :( If was awful to watch, and hard to describe to anyone who hasn't seen a similar thing.


Marianne,
Boomer does that too. Sometimes he is just standing there & sways. He looks like he is dizzy. But I have to say that all got much worse since his seizure on Tuesday. I'm confused is a macrotumor another tumor besides the tumor in his pituitary gland? Also, I have seen conflicting info on the net. I thought PDH was a benign tumor. I read some sites that state it is cancer.

I read this on a site (can't remember-been to so many-maybe vetinfo.com), anyway I know it was a quote from a vet ..


Dogs with Cushing's syndrome have been treated previously with chemotherapy drugs. The chemotherapy drugs stop the Cushing's syndrome in dogs by eroding the outer layers of the adrenal glands and reducing the adrenal glands ability to produce cortisol. Unfortunately, the chemotherapy drugs can go too far in the treatment of the Cushing's syndrome and cause the dog's adrenal glands to stop producing cortisol altogether. When this happens, a dog will have to take a hormone supplement for the remainder of their lives.

Don't know what to say about this but will ask my IMS.

same website....

Occasionally (10-15% of pituitary tumors) these tumors are larger and their size presents challenges of their own. Larger pituitary tumors (macroadenomas, over 1 centimeter in diameter) can place pressure on brain tissue and nerves, causing blindness, circling, seizures, or other neurological problems not directly related to hyperadrenocorticism. Some of these symptoms (e.g., incoordination) can resemble side-effects of medications used to treat Cushing's disease, further complicating diagnosis and treatment.

It's all crazy...so many things are related & I don't think the vets really know all the answers, just like physicians!

[amelia]

Debbie,
Yes, I know about vaccinations....I don't give my dogs vaccinations, only get titers every year. I just recently read about the rabies as well, so I won't be doing that now either. I usually give him Advantix in the spring, but I don't think that is a good idear either. I asked the oncologist & she said it was ok, but I don't think I will continue to do this....was not happy about doing it before he was sick.
What are your thoughts on that?

As far as a CT or MRI, the vet that diagnosed his Cushings last year suggested that, but what was the point since at that time I did not plan on radiation. I never thought I would do chemo. It just seems like it is never ending. And with all of this, I still have to get Comet diagnosed. We don't know what is going on with him.
Just shoot me!

[labblab]

Amelia, here's a few more thoughts from me...


Marianne,
Boomer does that too. Sometimes he is just standing there & sways. He looks like he is dizzy. But I have to say that all got much worse since his seizure on Tuesday. I'm confused is a macrotumor another tumor besides the tumor in his pituitary gland? Also, I have seen conflicting info on the net. I thought PDH was a benign tumor. I read some sites that state it is cancer.

My Barkis would stand and sway, too :o. Discussion about a "macrotumor" does refer to the pituitary tumor. Most pituitary tumors remain small, but if they enlarge to a certain size, they are referred to as macros. Also, most pituitary tumors are benign. But some can be cancerous. To further complicate matters, a dog can develop other brain tumors in addition to a pituitary tumor. So without imaging of the head, it's hard to know exactly what is going on.


I read this on a site (can't remember-been to so many-maybe vetinfo.com), anyway I know it was a quote from a vet ..

Dogs with Cushing's syndrome have been treated previously with chemotherapy drugs. The chemotherapy drugs stop the Cushing's syndrome in dogs by eroding the outer layers of the adrenal glands and reducing the adrenal glands ability to produce cortisol. Unfortunately, the chemotherapy drugs can go too far in the treatment of the Cushing's syndrome and cause the dog's adrenal glands to stop producing cortisol altogether. When this happens, a dog will have to take a hormone supplement for the remainder of their lives.

The "chemotherapy drug" that they are talking about is Lysodren. That is the other medication that is commonly used to treat Cushing's as an alternative to trilostane. Unfortunately, even if you switched to it, Lysodren would not have any effect on Boomer's lymphoma.

I can definitely relate to the uncertainty regarding whether symptoms are caused by medication or by underlying illness. We wondered for a time whether Barkis' problems were due to the trilostane, or something else. Our IMS did not think it was due to the medication, but we did discontinue it for a time as a trial. Stopping the trilostane didn't seem to help with the other problems (loss of appetite, pacing, confusion), and he seemed increasingly uncomfortable again with panting. So we started the trilostane back again, but at a reduced dosage. It can be so frustrating and so upsetting to try to figure out exactly what is going on...!

Marianne

[StarDeb55]

Amelia, the only thing that determines a micro vs. a macroadenoma is strictly size of the lesion. A macro is >1 cm. in size, micro is <1 cm. They are both non-malignant, size is the only difference.

Debbie

PS-Forgot about the flea treatment issue. I don't have to worry about it in Az., but I will tell you what happened that is similar. I adopted Chewy about 3 months or so prior to Barkley's crossing the bridge. Chew came from a breed rescue in Texas, & brought some unwanted visitors with him, TICKS! Because of Barkley's weakened immune system, the little buggers attacked him first & with a vengeance. All 3 dogs were infested, but the other 2 weren't nearly as bad. Something had to be done for B as he was being eaten alive. A Preventic collar was suggested by my derm vet. The instructions on the collar warned about use with an immunocompromised pup, so I called the oncologist. She agreed that something had to be done, & to go ahead & use it. I put the collars on all 3 dogs, & probably with 2 weeks or so, I couldn't find any of the nasty little things anywhere. This is just an example of you have to weigh the benefits vs. the possible side effects of everything you do for Boomer, now.

[Nathalie]

Amelia,

If you are going to re-check Thyroid function I personally would do a Free T4 as well as a T4. You cannot rely on a T4 alone, it is very unreliable. Also, I never let them do a Snap test in-house – no test is 100% reliable and that even goes more so for in-house testing.

Lyme disease can cause seizures among a gazillion of other symptoms – perhaps that is something to keep in mind too. Did Boomers infection clear? Sometimes this can take a very long time.

Here is an excellent site with TBD information http://sites.google.com/site/blackgsd/ and list http://saluqi.home.netcom.com/ticklinks.htm

I am glad you are no longer vaccinating – no dog with a compromised immune system and elderly should receive vaccinations it will only further suppress the immune system.
The same goes for any pesticides such flea and HW prevention etc. If you are living in an area that has a huge problem with ticks I suggest you join the above list – alternative tick prevention and management has been discussed many times – you will find tons of information in the archives.

Nathalie

[amelia]

Hi all,
Well we had our first chemo treatment. So far so good. Marianne, I think the weird things that happening are neuro related, either from the pituitary tumor or another tumor. More & more he paces, seems to be dizzy & loses his stepping. He is just standing there & he sways. A wind could blow him over. The docs think that too.

We will continue with the current chemo protocol & if he continues to have seizures, then she will alter it to penetrate the brain.
I was a little encouraged when I heard that lymphoma responds to chemo, but how many of those dogs have Cushings, seizures, possibly other brain tumor, low grade kidney disease due to the protein in his urine, although that is good since on trilstane & god knows what else is going on in this poor boys body. He hardly ate this morning & 2 hours later he vomited. I don't know if it is a coincidence or the chemo. Seems awfully soon for the chemo. They said it is rare with the first drug he was given & not usually until 5 days after. But he has never been a text book case.

Also, we decided to give the prednisone & continue with the trilostane. Initially I was against it but I understand that giving synthetic steroids & naturally producing it is handled differently in the body. They are hoping the pred will help with the brain swelling/inflammation. Also, I don't want to stop the trilostane since it has really helped him, especially with the protein in his urine.

Only time will tell with all this going on & I hope it will be on my side.

By the way, Natalie, Boomer has every possible test last year to check for every know tick & other infections. My vet did a lyme test & it was positive. Then when all the cushings symptoms started I took him to the University of Pennsylvania & they did a SNAP-4Dx test (Lyme, Ehrlichia, Anaplasma)Bartonellosis & others & came back negative. They think he could have had lyme previously, since I think you always test positive if you had it before.

We are all exhausted with all these tests & my boy is still sick. I might be fighting a losing battle but will try in the short term to see what happens.
Thanks

[Franklin'sMum]

Hi Amelia,
Just wanted to wish you and Boomer the best of luck with this chemo protocol. Fingers and paws crossed for you both
love Jane, Franklin and Bailey xxx
________
Zoloft Lawsuits (http://www.classactionsettlements.org/lawsuit/zoloft/)

[amelia]

Thanks to Jane, Franklin and Bailey....we need it.

[frijole]

I can't offer a bit of advice but me and mine are rooting and praying for you and Boomer! Hugs, Kim

[Squirt's Mom]

We are hanging with ya'll too, Amelia, sending healing thoughts and prayers for all.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always

[bkdice]

I am behind on the thread - I'm sorry!


I am very nervous about this & will stop if he gets too sick. The vets make it sound so cut & dry & recite text book stats. So I can't go by what they say since all dogs are different.

I KNOW how hard it is to make the choice to do chemo. It is a tough one and it is a difficult process on the caregiver emotionally. I have to say, my boy tolerated it much better than I did (as the caregiver)!! Hang in there and stay tough. You make the choice to treat out of love, and if you decide you need to make changes or stop at any time, that will also be out of love.

We had started Niko on acupuncture way before cancer (or cushings). It did wonders for him. When we started chemo, we increased our acupuncture visits. I think it help keep him feeling pretty well. He was not on any pain management for arthritis or anything until the last month or so of his life. Not bad for an older pup. I wish more people knew how beneficial acupuncture could be for mind, body, and spirit. Sorry to get off track.... glad your vet treats holistic too! Also very glad you are informed about the vaccinations and flea & tick.

On the LHD group board, there have been a lot of discussions about flea and tick products. Buckmountain is all natural organic flea and tick powder to consider. I have no experience with it yet, but it's on my list to try when I get doggies again.

I see from your most recent post that the 1st round is done. I know you must be drained... there is so much to learn and so many choices to make. Remember that you can always adjust drugs and dosage amounts. Keep a good open line of communication with your oncologist.

If this wasn't already mentioned (as I said, I'm behind), you should be pre-treating for nausea with pepcid 3 days before chemo. Often they'll give an ant-nausea with chemo (cerenia is most common now and it's awesome). They sent us home with cerenia each time, and metranidazole a few times too. It worked wonderfully for Niko! I just wish I had used it a day or two earlier.

We kept a good supply of pumpkin and pedia lyte (unflavored) on hand.

Other supplements that are important are fish oil and milk thistle. We also gave L-glutamine for his GI and a probiotic.

Please do keep us posted. I'm keeping an eye out for you on the LymphomaHeartDog board. I cannot tell you how beneficial it was to join that group while going through chemo. I do not think I would have made it through in one piece w/o the people on there!!!

You remain in my thoughts!!

Bettina

[Harley PoMMom]

Hi Amelia,

Lots of prayers being said for you and Boomer, and tons of positive and soothing energy being sent your way.

Love and (((hugs)))
Lori

[gpgscott]

Amelia,

I am sorry that I am just now finding your thread.

I can't help with any practical advice concerning Boomer, but I see that many others have.

I will be watching and praying for you all.

Scott

[StarDeb55]

Amelia, chemo is very tiring, so I suspect that is one of the reasons Boomer is not himself today. Side effects in the majority of cases, do not appear until about 3-5 days after treatment.

I'm not understanding something about the chemo protocol, along with treating the Cushing's which I'm hoping you can clarify. If you're not sure, I would strongly encourage you to ask these questions of both the oncologist & IMS. I need to ask this in 2 parts. First of all, I absolutely understand from the chemo protocols why the prednisone needs to be used, along with the possibility that it should help control inflammation/swelling in Boomer's central nervous system. Now, here's where I'm confused. Trilostane is used to lower the cortisol levels from the Cushing's. Pred acts just like naturally produced cortisol. Now, that you are giving pred as part of the chemo protocol, you are replacing the cortisol in the body that the trilostane is lowering. The 2 drugs are working against each other. I think you see why I'm confused??:confused:

Have either the oncologist or IMS indicated whether or not it would be beneficial to get a CT scan done of Boomer's brain, so you can hopefully see exactly what is going on? A macroadenoma would have a specific location in the brain as opposed to central nervous system spread of the lymphoma, so, IMO, the vets should be able to differentiate between the 2. I do not want to be a "gloomy, Gus", but I'm not sure if there is any effective chemo for a macroadenoma. If I were in your position with one of my boys, I would be asking these questions of all of Boomer's vet team.

Debbie

[bkdice]

How is Boomer doing? Been keeping you and he in my thoughts.

[amelia]

Boomer is doing great! He has been a new dog since yesterday. Eating, going for his daily walk, going up/down steps & most importantly no neuro symptoms. Is that weird or what? I guess it is the prednisone or maybe chemo. Also, I can't find the lumps!!!! My oncologist is on vacation this week & our next chemo is scheduled on 3-31 so I will be asking her alot of questions, especially yours Debbie.
I don't know if anyone heard of a site called "just answer". I have used it many times & always get a good reply. You can ask a vet or any other professional any question & if you like the answer then you pay for it.

Anyway, I asked about giving pred & Trilostance & this was the reply.

First of all, the body handles prednisone just like it would endogenous cortisone. The body does not recognize the difference. No, I do not think you should mess with the Trilostane. leave this. Yes, it may cancel each other out but Boomer will be getting the prednisone to stop the lymphoma. The Trilostane will stop the excess cortisone being manufactured by his body.

Debbie, if I get a CT I'am not sure if it would help. Most likely a brain tumor would be treated by radiation & I not sure if I want to do that or put Boomer through that either.

Has anyone heard or used "cushex drops"? http://www.nativeremedies.com/petalive/cushex-adrenal-support-dogs-cats.html

Thanks again to everyone for thinking of us. You all have been a great help!
I will keep you all updated.

[frijole]

What great news!!! I have been looking for an update and am soooo relieved. Thanks.

Re Cushex. Can you say "rip-off"? One of those "wonder cures" where no one that has tried them has seen any success. Glynda actually contacted them to get the scientific evidence backing their claims and was unable to get them to respond. If she sees this maybe she'll tell the story - it is pretty sad.

Anyway - thanks for getting back to us. Best wishes for continued success!! Kim

[labblab]

Amelia, this is terrific news regarding how well Boomer is doing!!! :) :)

Just out of curiosity, when was his last monitoring ACTH test done, and do you remember the results? I am just wondering whether his natural cortisol level may have dropped a bit too low on the trilostane, and whether that may be part of why the prednisone is making him feel so much better.

Also, as far as the value of performing a CT -- my own thought is that, prior to carrying out an expensive course of chemotherapy, you might want to find out whether it is a macro or other non-lympoma brain tumor that is causing the neuro problems. Since the chemo would not resolve a macro and the symptoms from the macro would continue to escalate, that information could affect your decision as to whether or not to continue with the full course of chemo. But I don't know what the relative costs of the CT vs. the chemo would be. And since Boomer is looking so good after this first treatment, it might feel really hard to stop the chemo at this point, regardless. As much as we Cushparents worry about giving prednisone to our babies, it can really be a miracle drug for a lot of issues, at least for the short-term. Even with a macro, I believe that the prednisone could help with the inflammation and swelling at least for a time. And maybe the fact that his neuro problems have resolved so significantly makes a macro seem less likely altogether. It really will be interesting to hear what your oncologist thinks when she gets back.

Anyway, regardless of the reason for Boomer's improvement, this is a great report!!!

Marianne

[bkdice]

Amelia ~ Thank you for the update!! I am SO HAPPY to hear Boomer is feeling well and that the lumps are not palpable. This is a REALLY good sign. :D :D :D

Please continue to keep us posted.

[amelia]

Marianne
I was thinking that too but my IMS says his #s are perfect. His last ACTH test was 1-15 & his pre was 1.1/post-2.4. I also spoke with Dr. Allen at DECHRA Pharm & he agrees.
I will talk to the oncologist on the 31st about the CT but she did say if he continues to have seizures, then she would alter the chemo to penetrate the brain.
For now, yes the pred is a miracle drug but I don't think the pred reduced his lumps. Most likely it was the chemo. But who knows!
All I know, for the time being my boy is back & looking great! Keep finger & paws crossed!

[amelia]

Hi Kim
Thanks for the info on the cushex drops. Glad I didn't order it. They make it sound so good.

[StarDeb55]

Amelia, I am ecstatic for both of you. When it comes to the CT, why look for trouble? If I were in your shoes, I think I would still ask the oncologist, IMS or both whether or not chemo would do anything for a macro? I would almost bet that the chemo can be adjusted to take care of any lymphoma lesions that may have crossed the blood/brain barrier. Call me a worry wart, but I'm just concerned that a macro is hiding out, masked by the lymphoma, & it's just waiting to rear its ugly head big time.

Debbie

[gpgscott]

Amelia,

I am not going to try to comment except to say how happy I am for you and Boomer.

You are having lots of good advice from others.

Very best to you both.

Scott

[labblab]

Hi Amelia,

Thinking of you and Boomer and Comet today, and hoping so much that things are still going well with Boomer's treatment. Whenever you have the chance, please check in and let us know how you all are doing, OK?

Marianne

[amelia]

Hi Everyone
Just an update. Boomer is in remission. None of his lump are palatable.
So far so good with the chemo. I feel so bad for him. He is panting like crazy from the prednisone. I give him the pred in the morning & the Trilostane at night so he has been sleeping through most of the night now.
He had another seizure Friday night. (so scarry for us). His oncologist said if he continues to have more then maybe she may alter his chemo. He may also have to go on seizure meds. She thinks he could have an meningioma but she is not sure. Not sure why she thinks this, she said it was her gut feeling. But the pituitary tumor can also cause seizures.
Of course, the only way to know is to have an MRI done. He would have to be put under anesthesia. I don't plan on doing it. For now, we are continuing with his chemo protocol & if the seizures continue, he will take yet another drug. Poor boy! After he had me up all night a nervous wreck, he started playing with his toys.
Gotta love them!!!

[frijole]

Amelia Thanks for the update. Sending warm thoughts and prayers your way. Boomer is a champ. Hugs, Kim

[Squirt's Mom]

Hi Amelia,

You and Boomer are real troopers! I am impressed with your dedication and devotion to your baby boy, and with his determination and will. What a joy that had to be to see him playing with his toys after such a bad nite! :)

I am so glad to hear that he is in remission and the lumps are no longer "feel-able". ;) That is great news! :D

Keep up the good work and let us know how ya'll are doing!
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always

[bkdice]

Just an update. Boomer is in remission. None of his lump are palatable.

WONDERFUL!!!!!! :D :D :D


So far so good with the chemo.

Also wonderful!

Keeping Niko cool helped him rest more comfortably. He had a few CoolBeds to lay on - http://www.khmfg.com/dogproducts/indoor-dog-products/cool-bed-iii

We would also rotate out the gel packs you put in the freezer. We'd wrap it in a towel and put it between his legs (front or back) or on his neck, when he rested. He loved them.

Hope Boomer has a LONG remission. I also hope the seizures don't become too much of an issue. I know it can be so hard to balance so many med.

Take care,
Bettina & Angel Niko

[StarDeb55]

I'm absolutely over the moon for both of you!! Let me just say to keep up with your lymph node checks, but don't run yourself crazy like I did initially. I was like checking Barkley at least daily, if not a couple of times a day. He would look at me like, "Not Again! I'm fine, please leave me alone!". I do hope they can find a resoution to control the seizures. One last thing, if you ever think Boomer is a little "off", but there is nothing specific that you can pinpoint, get him into the oncologist ASAP. I tell you this as Barkley has one of these "off" periods but there was nothing I could put finger on. I could not feel any nodes, but I called the oncologist & moved his monthly recheck up to where he was seen in a couple of days. His oncologist came in after taking a look at him, & told me that she went over him twice very carefully because she knew how well I knew him, & she figured something was up. She said the 2nd time she went over him, she found a single enlarged lymph node in back of one of his knees that wasn't even as big as a pea. She said she could have easily missed it, if I hadn't insisted something was not right. This is when B lost his first remission at 15 months.

Please keep us posted. I sure hope that Boomer has many, many more months to be with you.

Debbie

[amelia]

Hey Bettina
I have 4 cool beds in our house. My boys love them. They slept on them all their life & we also have cool scarfs for their neck which we use when we go on walks. They are very spoiled!
Yes, Debbie I am doing that...checking him every minute but we still have 16 more weeks of chemo so the oncologist is checking also.
I am very glad he is in remission. But the seizures really scare me more probably because I can see what it is doing to my boy. Anyway, I hope they will subside.
Thanks to everyone for all your support. Hugs & kisses from the boys!

[bkdice]

Just checking in on you and Boomer. How is he doing?

[sherrylwatts]

Just reading through this thread, so glad to hear Boomer is in remission! Hope he's doing well! My yellow lab (not the cushpup) has lymphoma, but by the time we found it, it had progressed to stage 3 (he never had lumps in his lymphnodes or anything) and he has a large mass on his intestine. After speaking with the oncologist we decided against chemo (she gave him only a 10 - 15% chance of remission, and warned us the remission time would prob be very short). We're treating him with Prednisone & Tramadol (pain meds for his arthritis). He was diagnosed on March 10th (less than a week after getting a clean bill of health from his regular vet), and he's behaving like a new dog - I know we're just treating symptoms, but at this point we're looking at quality of life, not quantity. Of course the vet was surprised when I called to refill his meds, no one expected him to hang on this long, but he looks like he's still going strong!

I'm interested in hearing how Boomer handles the chemo. So glad to hear its working out well for you guys! My hugs to both of you!

[bkdice]

Just reading through this thread, so glad to hear Boomer is in remission! Hope he's doing well! My yellow lab (not the cushpup) has lymphoma, but by the time we found it, it had progressed to stage 3 (he never had lumps in his lymphnodes or anything) and he has a large mass on his intestine. After speaking with the oncologist we decided against chemo (she gave him only a 10 - 15% chance of remission, and warned us the remission time would prob be very short). We're treating him with Prednisone & Tramadol (pain meds for his arthritis). He was diagnosed on March 10th (less than a week after getting a clean bill of health from his regular vet), and he's behaving like a new dog - I know we're just treating symptoms, but at this point we're looking at quality of life, not quantity. Of course the vet was surprised when I called to refill his meds, no one expected him to hang on this long, but he looks like he's still going strong!

I'm interested in hearing how Boomer handles the chemo. So glad to hear its working out well for you guys! My hugs to both of you!

I'm part of the LymphomaHeartDogs group on Yahoo (helped me through Niko's chemo) and there are dogs that successfully achieved remission at stage V - some of them over a year! Every dog is different though, so you never know what the outcome will be.

My sister didn't treat her dobie Max (this was years ago) and was not well educated on chemo options and outcome. He actually lived 6 months, so who knows if that wasn't the best option for him.

We each make the best choices we can for them - I know that. I almost didn't treat Niko, but so glad I did and bought him 8 months of remission and 9 months total time with a single agent chemo protocol. (He was my cush pup and age 16 when dxed with lymphoma) Hope your yellow lab still has many good days ahead.

[sherrylwatts]

Bkdice - don't want to hijack this thread, so I sent you a PM. I want to do everything possible for my baby and so I'm taking heart from all y'alls good results!

[bkdice]

Bkdice - don't want to hijack this thread, so I sent you a PM. I want to do everything possible for my baby and so I'm taking heart from all y'alls good results!

Sherry - Sending you story's from the lymphoma board via PM.

*****

Still hoping to get a Boomer update. :)

[zoesmom]

Just checking on how Boomer's doing? So glad to hear he's in remission. And, hopefully, no more seizures? My Zo had seizures (started long before cushings) and eventually had to take bromide for them (after starting trilo), which brought them almost to a stop (only one, after starting the bromide.) So I know how scary they can be. In the beginning of Zo's cush tx, she had some other very troublesome neuro-type symptoms (besides seizures) so I took her to a specialist who felt it could have been a meningioma or, less likely, the pit. tumor. We, too, opted not to do a CT scan or MRI. The good news.....Zo went on to have another four good years. Hoping for a positive update on Boomer. Sue

[amelia]

Boomer update
Unfortunately, he had another seizure on Friday but it was very short. We went to a Neurologist today. Of course, he wanted to do a MRI to know what we were dealing with. I decided not too since I would not plan on going any further with radiation and/or surgery.
He said most likely the seizures were not from the pituitary tumor because they do not usually cause seizures unless it has grown. Could be another tumor....Looking at the whole picture, he has Cushing, Lypmhoma & Seizures & it would not make sense to put him through more extreme testing or surgery since he has so many things going on. I really want to control the seizures so he will start potassium bromide tomorrow at a loading dose & then taper down. We will taper him off the prednisone & hopefully this will stop the seizures.
Hey Sue, I hope we do as good as Zoe did.

On a good note, he is still in remission & no chemo side effects. Hopefully, that will continue.

Tomorrow we are off to the oncologist again....I found a black spot on my other boy. I'm afraid it may be a melonoma. Please keep everything crossed for us.

[labblab]

Amelia, thanks so much for the update. I know it's a bit of a mixed bag with Boomer, but I'm so relieved that the lymphoma seems to be under control. And yes, all fingers and paws will be crossed for Comet -- you SOOOO deserve a break, as do your boys!!!

Marianne

[zoesmom]

Hi Amelia -

Thanks for the update. Hope the spot proves to be nothing on Comet.

On the bromide, it took some doing to get Zo on the right dose initially. The vet who prescribed the starting dose (not our reg. vet, but her partner) put Zo on the lowest dose for a dog her size (about 80 lbs. then) but over the next few weeks, it became clear that the dose was way too high. Zo started having major symptoms of bromide toxicity and the vet didn't want to lower her dose. I finally had to do it myself and when our reg. vet returned to town, she agreed with me and said she'd have done the same thing herself.

The signs of Zo's bromide toxicity were a lot like a very bad case of cushings, only then it got worse and it was like she was drunk all the time. Glassy eyed, staggering, major PU/PD/PP. Since bromide has a very long half life, the progression was slow. It took about 3 or 4 weeks (as it gradually built up in her system) for me to realize that something was seriously wrong and that it was the bromide dose. I did a lot of research at the time on dosing and have a wealth of info on bromide so if you have any questions or concerns, let me know.

Zo took sodium bromide - which is not much different from KBr. The dose that we eventually settled into was HALF of what that first vet put her on and she was fine after that, although it took several more weeks for her to 'come down' and get back to normal. (I think it was 1.1 cc compounded at 250 mg/ml - but would have to check on those measurements). The one seizure she had after that was when her bromide levels fell for reasons unknown into a non-therapeutic range (.8) The therapeutic range on the bromide blood test is 1 - 3 but Zoe was apparently very sensitive to it, and whenever her levels rose above 1.5 or 1.6 she'd start showing signs of toxicity and the higher the number, the more severe her response. Another time, she had gotten very sick (pancreatitis) and our then new IMS said to put her on a diet of chicken and rice for a few days. BIG MISTAKE. You should never suddenly change the diet of a dog on bromide. Same with treats - consistency is a must. It can throw the bromide/chloride balance out of whack if there is a diet change. It should be done very gradually or to a food that has the same chloride % (or close to it). The dog food companies can tell you what that content is - I contacted two or three via e-mail over the course of Z's bromide tx. Seems that vets don't know alot about these various factors with bromide, so if I can help you and Boomer avoid similar experiences, then great. I think I kept a lot of this bromide info on my other computer and can forward to you, if you need it. Booomer may not be near as sensitive to it as Zo was, but nobody ever told me what to watch for!!!! Learned the hard way. Sue

PS - The vet who started Zo on bromide at least picked the right drug. She contacted an IMS at the time and found out that bromide is the preferred choice for a dog on trilostane. So at least she got that right, I guess.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[bkdice]

Thank you for the update! I know it's hard not knowing what may be causing other issues. I battled this with Niko too, though luckily he had no seizures. I hope that Boomer's meds / supplements help ease that for you.

I am happy to hear he's still in remission and tolerating chemo well. :)

Let us know how the dark spot turns out. I tell you, once you've been through cancer (or any other life altering disease) you get paranoid about every spot. I know I do, at least! :eek: Hope it's nothing. :)

Bettina

[amelia]

Sue,
Was Zo sleeping alot on the bromide? Boomer is sleeping all day & his back legs are more wobby than usual. Oh, boy is he panting now!

He is on 2,500mg per day for 10 days -loading dose & then goes down to 1,250mg. Boomer is 78 lbs. My dosing sounds so different than yours..???

Also, curious to know what how much Trilostane Zo was on?

I'll post Comet's update under his post.

[zoesmom]

Amelia -

We didn't 'load' Zoe with the bromide. I know that's another way to do it in order to get them up to a therapeutic range more quickly. And the potassium bromide may be a little different as far as measurements go. I'm not sure but will check thru my bromide info tomorrow and let you know. I do recall we had a boxer here who was also on bromide - pretty sure it was Kbr, like Boomer - and I want to say that her dose was like 600 or so - probably bid. But that was on the old cush board so I can't go back and check. The compounding and dosing/strength was very confusing to me at first but when I sat down and played around with the numbers, it got easier. So is Boomer's bromide compounded into a flavored liquid? And what exactly does the label say as to dose and strength?

I wouldn't say that Zoe was exactly sleepy but more like I said earlier . . . drunk! In a stupor. Stumbling around and really just out of it. However, I guess that could explain wobbly legs. Zoe also had severe polyphagia - something she never had - even with the cushings, which is rather uncommon for a cush pup. And of course, the increased thirst and peeing (which she DID have with the cushings.) The hunger was so bad that she'd sit at my elbow and bark or whine constantly until I gave her food. Did they tell you to watch for signs that Boomer might be 'loaded' before that ten days is up.? I don't know the specifics on how bromide loading works, but I would think that some dogs could load much faster than others, just like with lysodren. Will check and see if I have anything on that, as well.

I'm not sure how much trilo Zo was taking when we started her on bromide. But generally, she was on a pretty high dose (after a bad start when we had to back her way down to 40 mg and then work her back up over the course of several weeks.) By the time we decided that she needed the bromide - several months into the trilo - she was probably taking 150 to 180 mg. of trilo bid. :eek::eek::eek:

I often wondered if the suppression of cortisol allowed a tumor in her head (either pit. or other) to grow ever so slightly in size and thus caused her seizures to increase. The seizure that sent us flying to the bromide had lasted over 11 minutes.....super-scary. So to me, the bromide was a blessing. Sue

PS - For Zo's original dose - the one that made her so 'drunk', you would figure it this way: It was something like 2.2 cc (same as ml), compounded at 250 mg/ml . . . so that's 2.2 X 250 mg = 550 mg per dose. At twice a day, that = 1100 mg. per day. So that's really not too far off from what you are saying Boomer will take once he's loaded. His weight is pretty close to what Zoe weighed. And I think I recall that with KBr, the dose is usually slightly higher than with NaBr. The only problem would be if Boomer turns out to be extra sensitive to it, like Zoe apparently was. The dose that finally worked for her was HALF of that original dose. And the original dose was supposed to be the recommended MINIMUM for a dog her size. Her seizures weren't frequent (like every couple of months she'd have one) but they were mostly grand mal, several minutes long, and usually 'doubles' . . . . and then they began to last longer and longer, after she started on the trilo. So I wanted to give her the very least amount of bromide that would keep them in check. We had to play around a bit to find that perfect 'minimum.' We kept her on 1.5 cc for awhile and then I slowly edged her down to 1.1 and that seemed to be adequate for her. Also, I mentioned about the diet. When the vet put her on the chicken and rice diet, within several days she started showing signs of bromide toxicity again. And it took me a couple days more to put two and two together, and realize that it was the change of diet that was throwing everything off.

[amelia]

Hi Sue
Just thought I would give you guys an update on Boomer. He doing much better. With all that craziness going on with his KBr, I reduced his dose to 500mg per day until we followed up with the Neurologist. He agreed to keep him on that dose & up it to 750 in 6 weeks & get another bromide level. Believe it or not, his bromide level was 0.7 with the range of 1-3. But I don't think that could be accurate especially since I had him off the bromide for 5 days prior to the test & 2 days the week before & then the dose was up & down. So we'll see in 6 weeks what it is at 500mg/day. It is almost 2 months since his last seizure....knock on wood, don't want to jinx him!

He is still in remission for the lymphoma & has no side effects from the chemo. So we think that all the problems were probably with the bromide. But he is still on the prednisone & is getting weined off it over 2 weeks. So we will see if he has rear leg problems after that. If that is the case, then we will just keep on him on the pred at a low dose.

Thanks again for all the info, I refer to it often.

[zoesmom]

Amelia -
So glad to hear that things have sort of settled down for you and Boomer. That .7, of course, is not quite in the therapeutic range of 1 - 3, where it needs to be. And as I mentioned, Zoe did have one more seizure when her bromide level fell to .8

So, ideally, Boomer's levels need a slight bump up, just to make sure there are no more seizures. That reading may actually be pretty accurate, since it sounds like he missed a number of doses - the week before and leading up to the test. But I think what you're saying is that it would be better if he'd been on a consistent dose for several weeks in order to get a reading that you know would be fairly constant over time. Even tho' the drug has a long half life, once they reach steady-state, any dose changes can apparently have an effect within a relatively short time (basing on the fact that Zo began showing signs of bromide toxicity within less than a week of going on the chicken/rice diet.)

Her ideal bromide blood level turned out to be around 1.3 - 1.5. Pretty much smack in the middle of the recommended range. Some dogs, however, seem to tolerate a much higher level. Like with so many other things, it seems to be a matter of trial and error for each individual dog.

If Boomer's next test shows that he is above 1 - even just a little bit - I think I'd be inclined to stick with his current dose for a while and, provided there's no more seizures, that might be enough for him. You can always increase the dose if there's another seizure. But for me, I didn't want Zoe getting one speck more than she needed. She took so many meds, as it was.

It can be tricky trying to 'read them' when they have so many complicated issues. But it gets easier. And I think you're definitely on the right track so just keep on doin' what you're doin'...... :):):) Sue

[amelia]

Yes, you are right. I will keep him at this level if his next test shows him at 1 or higher, if not I will increase to 750. I went through this same thing when we started the Trilostane & it took months before we came to a dose that would keep his Cushings in check but not make lethargic & also making his rear legs weak. So, I am not surprised we are going through this again. Like your Zoe, I think he is sensitive to the meds, but thank God he hasn't been to the chemo.

On another note, Boomer will be 12 years old tomorrow. Yea!!!!:):):)

We are having a party with cake & ice cream & his buddies. Yes, I know I'm nuts but aren't we all!!!!

[zoesmom]

Well, Happy Birthday, Boomer! Twelve, huh? You deserve the very bestest birthday party ever 'cause twelve is a big deal for a boy who's been thru so much.

And no, Amelia, I don't think it's nuts at all. Zoe went to a birthday party for one of her furry friends from the park once. All the dogs who played together at the park were invited. Doggy treats and lots of fun for all. All the buddies loved it and they played and romped and partied till they dropped. Hope your party is just as fun, Boomer! Sue

[Casey's Mom]

Happy Birthday Boomer!!!!

I hope you have a great day and fun at your party with lots of treats.:D:D:D

Love and hugs,

[bkdice]

So glad Boomer is still in remission and tolerating chemo well. Happy birthday to him! :)

[Harley PoMMom]

Happy 12th Birthday Boomer!!!

Wishing you a day full of your favorite things because you are so special.

Love and hugs,
Lori

[amelia]

Boomer says "thanks" everyone for the Birthday Wishes. I will post some pictures of our big day later.

[acushdogsmom]

Just saw the terrific birthday party pictures! Happy Birthday, Boomer! :D

[mypuppy]

Happy belated birthday Boomer. You are such a handsome boy. I love your very sweet face. Hope you had a special and fun filled day because you are so deserving. Gentle belly rubs and licks. Much love, xoxoxoxoxoxoxo Jeanette and Princess

[labblab]

Best belated birthday greetings from our house, too!!!!!! :) :p :D :) :p :D

Tons of hugs and well wishes from
Marianne, Peg and Luna

[amelia]

Re Cushex. Can you say "rip-off"? One of those "wonder cures" where no one that has tried them has seen any success. Glynda actually contacted them to get the scientific evidence backing their claims and was unable to get them to respond. If she sees this maybe she'll tell the story - it is pretty sad.

Kim
I was researching supplements for Boomer and came across the Pet Alive website...Cushex & EaseSure and them remembered you mentioning this is a previous post.
I'm glad you told me about this. Cushex is made by Pet Alive. Are you familiar with any of their other products? Are all of them a "rip-off"?
Thanks

[gpgscott]

Not Kim here, but I am sure we will hear from her also.

We have all had lots of experiece good and bad with supplements. My take is that this disease is so had to control the conventional way that anyone with a truly viable treatment would have accepted studies backing up their claim. Unfortunately most rely on hyperbolic user testimonial or statements made by persons trying to come off as medical professionals who have no medical credentials.

Personally I find the claims and tactics of the Cush... people so outrageous that I do not place credence in any of their offerings. There is also the issue of now knowing were most of these products are made and what materials they may be contaminated with which may cause long term harm. The melamine issue in treats from China comes to mind.

I suspect anything which is a secret proprietary blend. There are lots of good liscenced meds and single purpose OTC supplements which I think are a much better bet.

Scott

[frijole]

Hi! No I am not aware of their other products. Just the ones promising a miracle cure for cushing's. It is sad really as people buy this expecting truth in advertising. :( Kim

[amelia]

Hi
Sorry I haven't written but wanted to give you an update on Boomer. His lymphoma is still in remission (8 months now) but his seizures are really increasing. He is having them every couple of days now. He was on 500 mg Kbr for six months & no seizures. Now they are starting again. We increased his dose to 750mg on 10-7 & increased his prednisone to 10mg, 2x dy. Our neurologist loaded him again for 4 days on 10-22 up to 1,750 mg. He is very lethargic & his back legs as really bad. We increased him again to 1,000,mg on 10-28 & he had 3 seizures since. Most troubling is his rear legs, specially his right right. Initially, he was knuckling his toes. Now since we increased his Kbr, he is dragging his right leg. He cannot walk without assistance. I am using a bottoms up leash to help him. (thank god with this leash). He has NO strength in that leg & cannot keep the paw on the ground. My oncologist feels it is caused by an meningioma, which may be. But before the increase in bromide he was dragging only his toes & now the he drags the legs. I know the bromide is making this worse but I can't decrease it because the seizures are increasing. But he has no quality of life right now. We have an appt with the neurologist on Monday. I wonder it there are other anticonvulsant drugs that would have less side effects. He has always been sensitive to meds & usually need the least amount. I am very concerned that we may not be able to do anything more for him.

Sue, did Zoe have a rear leg problem like this? I know these drugs cause ataxia but it is more pronounced in the one leg than the other, probably the side of the tumor.

Please keep us in your prayers. Thanks

[labblab]

Oh Amelia, I'm so sorry to hear about these increasing problems for Boomer. I will definitely be keeping you both in my thoughts and prayers. Please continue to keep us updated. Unfortunately, I don't know anything about seizure meds. But I'm hoping that some other folks with more experience will soon be stopping by.

Many hugs,
Marianne

[zoesmom]

Hi Amelia -

I'm so sorry to hear that Boomer is not doing so well. Meningioma (if not pituitary macrotumor)was also suspected with Zoe. The loading on 10/22 - was that for the bromide? What's his total daily dose now (not sure about the figures you gave)? But it sounds like it's getting up there. I suppose the ataxia from that last loading could be aggravating the leg problems but it doesn't explain the increase in seizures. I assume that the vet did do a bromide test right before that load - or sometime recently? If so, what was the result?

Also, how is Boomer's cortisol doing? Is he still on trilostane? I always felt like letting Zoe's cortisol run a little on the high side would help, if indeed she had a tumor in her head. That's because of the natural anti-inflammatory effect of cortisol (just like the pred). And she did seem to do better when her numbers were between 5 and 10. So if Boomer's cortisol is below 6 or 7, I wonder if letting it hover up around 9 or 10 or even 11 or 12 would help with whatever is going on in his head. If his cortisol is lower than 5, I would suspect that might be playing into the increased seizures - byallowing a tumor to grow. Again, don't know but seems like a logical guess.

As much as I hate to say it, it does sound like there's something serious going on in Boomer's head. I know the knuckling of the feet is one of the things they look for in cases of brain tumors. Zoe did have lots of problems with her legs giving out (one more than the other), especially towards the end. But she did not have the knuckling. She had had the seizures and Horner's syndrome pre-cushings. Then in her last half year, the severe case of vestibular syndrome - which never totally went away. And then two months later, she started having some disorientation plus would lay around a bark for periods of time at nothing and for no apparent reason. And then finally came the blindness. I thought at first that it came on overnight, but maybe it had been coming on slowly and I just didn't realize it? But that last day, it was clear she could see nothing and that was when I knew it was enough. Mostly because she needed her sight in order to keep her balance with the CVS.

There are other meds for seizures. Phenobarb, of course, but it's very hard on the liver. Some vets will do a combo of PB and bromide. Don't know if it's any more effective though. Before I put Zo on bromide, I corresponded with one of the Guardian Angels people (k9 epilepsy site) about using a narcotic ((forget which narcotic it was), administered anal-ly, only when a seizure occurred. I've forgotten a lot about it, except that I thought it was kinda scary, it was hard to get the med because of the class of drug , and I think it was recommended mostly for those dogs who have long seizures. Zoe's came in doubles, one right after the other, and the last bad one lasted almost 12 minutes with no break. But I gave up on the narcotic idea and went with the bromide then.

Sadly, it sounds like you are in a catch 22 and that's when it gets harder to know what to do. Zoe was a fighter but I realized at the end that we were fighting a losing battle. Do discuss all the options with your IMS - maybe he has some other thoughts. Sending hugs to Boomer. I do understand what you are going through. :( Sue

[Rebelsmom]

Amelia, I'm so sorry to hear what you and Boomer are dealing with. I don't know much about what you are dealing with, but my thoughts and prayers are with you.

Lots of hugs for you and Boomer

[Squirt's Mom]

Hi Amelia,

So sorry to read that Boomer is having such problems. :( I wish I had a magic wand to wave over you both...or at least a suggestion, but I have neither. I do have many healing thoughts, prayers, hugs and belly rubs to send in abundance for you and Boomer and they are flying your way.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always

[SasAndYunah]

Hi Amelia,

Like Sue, I was in the same place where you are right now, with my dog suffering from epilepsy, Cushings and several other conditions. Neither of the Bromides worked for my dog, Phenobarb wasn't working either so he was put on Epitard. The Epitard did control his seizures but they never went away. Sometimes you have to "balance" between what's acceptable. Increasing the meds more and more with all (possible) side effect or accepting some seizure activity. Also, I had to "balance" between wich meds did not go together and could cause serious side effects and what am I prepared to let him go through. I finally decided to give him certain meds that would keep him comfortable but held the risk of shortening his lifespan due to side effects. And he did indeed die of acure liverfaillure... But without all those meds (the combination of them), his life would have lasted perhaps a few weeks longer but it would have been an awful life. Or as I like to say, not a dog worhty life.

These are the difficult decissions we face and it is indeed a catch 22. If you withold one med then a certain condition gets worse, if you withold another med, another condition gets out of control, but when you give all the meds needed, the possible side effects may creep up on you.

So talk with your IMS, decide what's most important and in the best interest of Boomer. How can you make his life dog worthy for as long as possible..? what will that mean in terms of side effects, etc.

Wishing you all the strength you need right now,

Saskia and Yunah.

p.s. I think Sue is reffering to liquid Valium/Stesolid. I used it with my dog once he started seizuring. It's easy to administer (indeed anally) and will possibly shorten the seizure.

Also, just now remember that there was a period where I gave Cukie a Valium tablet each night. That would also help him sleep and decrease the chance of seizures. He had nocturnal seizures, meaning only a night, and the Valium helped getting him through the night more relaxed.

[amelia]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts & prayers!

Sue, yes the loading was for the bromide. Although he has been on it for 6 months @500mg, they loaded him to 1,750 for 4 days because he starting having seizuers again. We increased it to 1,000 mg/dy on 10-28. I think the 1,000mg is too much for him. We are in a catch 22 because he needs a higher dose of bromide to control the seizures but the higher dose makes him lethargic & kills his back legs (especially the one). 1,000 mg is still less than what he should be on for his weight. His last bromide level was in May & it was .5 (should be around 1.5) So he was not on a therapeutic dose but coincidently he did not have a seizure for 6 months on that dose. I read that it could take 4-6 weeks to get use to the increased dose. So I don't know if his body will get use to it or if the rear leg is really from the tumor increasing. Interesting though, he was doing great up until the day before the increased loading dose & it has been downhill since. So my only glimmer of hope is that it is related to the bromide. But I won't know for a couple of weeks or if we stop the bromide for a few days which I am afraid to do now.

He is still on Trilostane -50mg/dy & no cushings symptoms BUT he is also on prednisone, 20mg/dy. I know it sounds like we are defeating the purpose of the Trilostane but he does need the prednisone to help fight the inflammation of the tumor. Apparently, with cushing you can't control how much extra contisol they produce, so we give the Trilostane to keep that in check & then give the pred for the suspected tumor. We also tried 2 treatments of chemo (CCNU-it crosses the blood brain barrier) but it didn't do anything.

We haven't retested his cortisol because we are giving him prednisone- so it would be a waste to test. I don't know what else to do. I am hoping there are other meds for seizures that do not have the same side effects. I believe the phenobarbital does have the same effects.

As far as the narcotic, I think you are referring to valium. I have valium suppositories for emergency. It is ususally used for cluster seizures, which we haven't had them yet. Thank god!

[amelia]

Hi everyone
It's me again. Well, I have good news & not so good. The good news first....our Neurologist took Boomer off the potassium bromide & put him on Keppra. That was over 2 weeks ago & no seizures since. The better news - no awlful side effects like he had with the bromide. Each day he is getting stronger & is able to get himself up. Before he was hardly lifting his head. I had 2 harnesses on him & was lifting him to go out to potty. That was really hard lifting a 77lb dog when they are dead weight. Now he does most of the lifting but I have to assist his rear end. Now we need to evaulate the rear end problem when all of the bromide is out of his system (21-30dys). It has been 16days since we stopped. Hopefully, when it is completely out, the Keppra will continue to help him.

Since his rear end is weak (specifically) his rear right leg, he is dragging it behind him. He has developed a horrible sore in the inner side of his paw almost to the bone. We had it wrapped for weeks but it still became raw. Now it is wrapped with a million layers of wrapping & hope it will heal. Once it does, I just ordered a rear leg splint to help him not to knuckle/drag the leg. Has anyone ever used it? This is the link. http://www.orthovet.com/storefront.html?title=storefront.html&page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=43&category_id=13&vmcchk=1 I hope it will help.
This boy sure has gone through alot. We go back to the oncologist on Friday for a re-check. Hopefully, that will be good news. Now we have to work on the leg.

[Squirt's Mom]

Hi Amelia,

Check this link out. These folks are miracle workers and have hearts of pure gold! They may be able to help Boomer with his mobility. It sure can't hurt to talk to them.

http://www.eddieswheels.com/

I hope the change in meds does the trick for him and he is feeling much better soon!

Keep your chin up!
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls :D - always

[Roxee's Dad]

Hi Amelia,

We tried the Eddie's wheels for our Rozee, she hurt he knees a few days after her 15th birthday. She got used to them very quickly and was quite happy with the freedom after almost 3 weeks of being carried and helped around.

Here is a link to her video, this was Day 2 of being in her wheels. She can now walk on her own although we are still in conservative management and don't let her do too much without her wheels. She now goes potty and eats unassisted.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-yJ3hStJVs

We also did swimming therapy.

One thing to keep in mind is if Boomers front legs are strong enough to pull himself around, sounds as if they are.

[amelia]

Thanks John, Leslie & the girls for the info on eddieswheels. I already ordered a leg splint & should get it on Monday. I'll see how that goes first.
Hi oncologist check went good...still in remission! The sore on his leg is pretty raw, so I have to keep it really bandaged. Hopefully that will heal so we can try the splint.

[amelia]

It is with a VERY heavy heart that I have to tell you that Boomer was put to sleep on 4-29. He had been fighting numerous diseases over the last 2 years & could not fight any more. As some of you know, he was diagnosed with Cushings (2) years ago & was treated & doing good. He was diagnosed with lymphoma last year & with chemotherapy he was in remission for 13 months. But he also had a brain meningioma (although slow growing), it caused him to have seizures & rear leg knuckling & weakness. Eventually, his front legs started to give out & he no longer wanted to eat (which was his favorite thing to do).
It was very hard to make this decision but it was the best thing for him. He was my best friend for 13 years and will be greatly missed.
Thanks to everyone for your encouragement and prayers. I dreaded facing this day but knew in my heart it was coming soon. Good luck to everyone in this forum with a Cushings pet. As you can see from my experience with the correct dosage & early treatment, Cushings can be treated-although not cured but Boomer was doing very well on the Trilostane. I believe without his other medical problems, he still would be with me today.

[bkdice]

Hi Amelia. I am so saddened to read that Boomer has crossed the bridge. I am familiar with how hard it is to fight multiple diseases, including cushings and lymphoma, and I applaud you and Boomer for your fighting determination. 13 months of remission is several dog years, and when it comes to cancer, that is pretty great.

What a great mom you were to care for him on so many levels and also finding it in your heart to selflessly let him go when the time came. May happy memories of your boy always help you smile through the pain of loosing him.

Sincere condolences...

[littleone1]

I am so sorry to hear about Boomer, Amelia. My thoughts and prayers are with you. You did what was best for Boomer.

[Squirt's Mom]

Dear Amelia,

I am so sorry to hear about Boomer. He was a trooper and had the best mom by his side he could have asked for. You worked tirelessly for him and I know he felt your love in every touch and word.

I do believe you will see Boomer again. You will hold your best friend and walk with him for all eternity. Til then, he is watching over you with all the love and devotion he has to give.

Our deepest sympathies,
Leslie, Squirt, Trinket, Brick and our Angels, Ruby and Crystal


A Special Gift

They're a very special gift, to be cherished and loved;
You're chosen for each other by God Himself above.
It's a match made in heaven so it can't be wrong;
You're tied together by a bond that's oh so strong.

All they'll ever ask from you is to be loved and fed,
And at night make sure they have fresh water and a bed.
In return, for so little, the rewards are so great!
You'll get a companion for life with some very special traits.

When you are lost and the end seems so far away
They'll walk by your side, they'll help you find your way.
When life gets you down they can put a smile on your face
As they run you in circles with their fast pace.

You'll share the good with the bad, you'll be happy and sad;
And through it all you have a friend, the best you ever had.
You're time together will be special and unique;
It will be as priceless to you as a rare antique.

Then, before you know it, the day will arrive
When suddenly your life takes a steep dive.
The furry friend who's been with you for all of these years
Has now passed on and left you in tears.

As you sit and wonder what did I do?
Why is this all happening to you?
Into each of our lives a little rain must fall,
And you must be strong to answer the call.

Your little one's spirit has flown home on the wings of a dove,
To a special place that awaits them in heaven above.
St. Francis will meet them; when they get home
He will take them to a meadow where they're free to roam.

There in the meadows, down by the pond,
Your furry friend will remember his loving bond.
He'll look into the water, then you appear;
He can see you're frightened, he can feel your fear
He'll look into the water, then you appear;
He can see you're frightened, he can feel your fear
Through the bond that still ties you from heaven above
He looks down upon you, he sends you his love.

Through the bond that still ties you from heaven above
He looks down upon you, he sends you his love.
Because you loved him and because you care
Whenever you need him, he'll always be there.

There, in the meadows, they patiently wait for the day
When you will celebrate your life together, each and every day.
Waiting for that day; when you come walking back home
When together for an eternity through the meadows you'll roam.

Author Unknown

[jrepac]

Rest in peace Boomer, you deserve it.

My condolences on your loss.


Jeff & Angel Mandy

[marie adams]

Dear Amelia,

I am so sorry for your loss. We all know too well how hard this time is for you and your family. :(

You have soooo many wonderful stories to share and share them often because it helps.:)

Take care!!

[mytil]

Very big ((((((hugs))))))) to you Amelia.
Terry

[zoesmom]

Amelia -

I know how heartbroken you are. It is so difficult to let them go but sometimes it is the only fair thing to do. I expect Zoe was there to greet him. Boomer was blessed to have you as his mommy. He is now whole again and running free. ((((Hugs)))) - Sue

[Casey's Mom]

Hello Amelia,

I am saddened to hear of Boomer passing, he had to deal with so many issues poor boy. I hope you can find joy in your many wonderful memories and know that he is with you in your heart as always.

Love and hugs,

[bgdavis]

Amelia,

I'm sorry to read that Boomer has made the final journey. May he rest in peace and may you and yours find solace in the memories.

Bonnie and Angel Criss

[k9diabetes]

I am so very sorry to learn of Boomer's passing. I think it's especially hard when you have fought so hard for them. I know his life was blessed by you and yours by him.

Natalie